# genetics of teat spur



## Dana (Dec 7, 2009)

I am interested in a friend's Nigerian doeling but it has a teat spur. I have not seen the kid yet to know how extensive it is. My question is, will the doe be worth keeping as a breeding doe? She is purebred and registered, but I just don't want to bother if there is a high chance of offspring having this trait.

Also, if this doeling is just "pet" quality, is there a way to clip the spur off for a 4-H kid to show her in fair?


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## chell20013 (Feb 7, 2011)

Somewhere I saw a picture of a doe who had a spur or extra teat clipped off and when the new owners were not aware of it. When the doe came into milk, the clipped area ballooned up because it was weak there. I have no idea if it's alright to clip if she is not going to be bred.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

You just don't want to mess with the genetics. You know that it is a genetic fault...carried by not just this kid, but recessively by her dam and/or sire. And maybe not even recessivly if the dam or sire has had a spur or extra teat cut off. Just like those who don't cull for bad bites, or poor breed character, there are those who don't cull for extra teats because they can be cut off and if you don't show to them it's no big deal. Our LaMancha's we had on the dairy side of our farm were plagued with extra teats from a old bloodline who felt this way about that, just clip them off if they don't have an orifice.


I would run.


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## chell20013 (Feb 7, 2011)

Extra teats---arrgghh! I have a boer I'm milking that has a total of 7 teats, 4 on one side 3 on the other and all clustered together. 4 of them function. Milk squirts all over the place! She did have twins, both with 4 normal looking teats, but, yes, she will be a cull.


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## adillenal (Feb 6, 2009)

I have only had one doeling born with a teat spur and I culled her.


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## Guest (Feb 25, 2011)

I had one years ago, sold her as pet only with no papers.. I show and was worried that it would haunt me if I kept any of her kids etc... or bred her again.. Not sorry I let her go, and she has very nice udder.


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## Faithful Crown Nubians (Dec 5, 2007)

One of the doelings last year had a teat spur....She was culled (put down).


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## Dana (Dec 7, 2009)

Thanks all, very helpful. I'm still learning about genetics and what I want on my farm. So glad I asked. I get tempted to acquire things I don't need.


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## Grumpy Old Buck (Feb 5, 2011)

On a side note, but relevant to any reason for culling...

One of my pet peeves is when a "less than keeper quality" animal is then said to be or could be offered as a 4-H animal.

If it isn't good enough to register and keep in the registered genepool it has no place (in my opinion) for a 4-H kid to get, work with, decide they really love it, and then decide they want to show in some open classes. Disaster and heartbreak.

As with rabbits when I was showing -- I seldom give a 4-H/youth discount, but I DO offer top quality from my breeding stock to youth who show a sincere interest and have proven they can and will care for the animals properly. In fact, I almost never advertised stock for sale in any of the rabbit show catalogs or club newsletters -- word of mouth when a youth would wing BIG at open shows was the best advertising and highly effective tool there was.

I just want to toss that out there to be mindful of offering what might be considered second-class animals to the youth breeders. Somewhere that reasoning will truly bite us on the backside!


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## Lynn_Theesfeld (Feb 21, 2010)

Excellent post Bill!


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## Laverne (Apr 4, 2010)

So, if there were two doe kids born and one had a teat spur, the other didn't, would you cull both?


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## Dana (Dec 7, 2009)

The doeling with the teat spur is being offered for _only_ $250 instead of $300. I politely refused, because even if she was just a "pet", I keep bucks on my farm and if she got accidentally bred, it would have to be culled.

Laverne, that's a good question about keeping the sister of a defect. It would probably depend on their parents. Has it happened back somewhere in the genealogy? If so, I think the sister could carry that defect to her offspring.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

There is a nubian breeder who had a kid with parrot mouth being sold for a $50 discount, because her paperwork was so superior, she would be worth having on pedigree...Seriously????

Lavern, if it's your goats that you have bred awhile, especially an older doe (they seem to have more genetic faulted kids, perhaps old eggs) and you never see problems, than sure cull the spur teat kid and keep the sister. Genes line up in very different ways and full siblings are not all that related. If I had a buck or doe who did have this gene I would never sell or keep a buck out of her or him. 

Everything is just so personal, what you choose to do with your herd and what someone else does. And also in how personal all this is taken, their livestock, they are going to have genetic faults, deal with it, learn from it and don't pass off your trash eat them. V


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## goatkid (Oct 26, 2007)

The first Nubian kid I bought (for $25) had an extra teat. I didn't know to look for this. The breeder hadn't checked either. I did breed her and her kids were normal teated. I sold her to a commercial dairy who didn't care because it didn't interfere with milking. A year or so later, I was given a Nupine doeling with four teats. This doe was originally supposed to be used for breeding Boer for meat kids. I did breed her dairy as well, but her kids were never sold as show stock even though all but one had normal teats. They went either to a commercial dairy or to a meat breeder. The only reason we kept this doe is because she milked over a gallon a day. I lost her at 4 years old to milk fever. This was the last such doe I kept. Last year the doeling out of one of my nicest yearlings had a spur teat. She went to the meat buyer. Since my goal is to breed show quality Nubians, and I have to cull to keep my numbers down, she had to go.
That person who wanted to charge you $250 for a doeling with that defect is trying to rip you off.


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## adillenal (Feb 6, 2009)

I agree about keeping or selling anything with genetic defects. All culls and that means kill not sell as a "pet". Of course I don't believe in selling any goat for a pet anyway. Just my personal opinion.


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## Dana (Dec 7, 2009)

> Of course I don't believe in selling any goat for a pet anyway.


LaNell, I don't believe in _keeping _any goat as a pet. :rofl Actually they are all pets in a way, but they have a specific purpose on my farm. I respect your take on not selling pets. Lots of times, those pet goats end up in the meat auction eventually.

I do sell wethers to people in the area for pets or 4-H projects. People want them. Most of the locals around here moved from the big cities. They want the slower life and say that goats are relaxing for them. Some want a pet that is not a dog, for an array of reasons.


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## dragonlair (Mar 24, 2009)

My very first milker has a small teat spur, I was very new and didn't even realize it until i got home. Her younger full sister was normal, and all her doe kids were normal teated too. She was the only one who had that defect, and I had several generations of kids from her and her sister. She was not good enough to keep buck kids from anyway, so that was a moot point, but she was a great solid easy milker for a first timer and she taught me a lot. Her full sister did great in the show ring, but back then none of the bucklings went for breeding anyway, they were all sold to a dealer for meat.


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## alidansma (Aug 23, 2009)

I had a lady new to goats who just had her first kids born last week. She bought Nigerians with horns and one of them had a spur teat (her discription was the teat looked like a little mitten with a "thumb" coming off of the main teat) When she brought the kids over to be disbudded, I checked the babies. Sure enough one of the little girls has a split teat. She asked if we could remove it so she could still be a milker...no I couldn't - they were right next to each other, exactly the same size, with no way to tell if one or both were functional.


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