# sponge-like curd



## mulish (Apr 26, 2009)

i made an attempt at using clabber as starter culture for cheese. i used fresh raw milk @ 86F, and added approx 3% by total volume clabber (that had been in a closed clean jar till solids formed at ~70F). waited an hour, added rennet.
checked it this am at about 9-10 hours, and saw the typical curd waiting under the whey - looked like normal chevre, but did not have a smell. i usually let the curd go between 12 & 20 hours, depending on my day, so this one continued to sit until about 18 hrs. just went to dip & drain and it has floated to surface and is light & spongy like lung tissue with holes throughout and smells, um, not good. the odor is not knock-you-down bad, it smells sort of chemically? bleachy? we're having a hard time describing it. . .
my own cheese detective skills tell me that something has gone wrong. :lol 
so much for my delicious clabber cheese! any ideas about where this went wrong? i did what i do with chevre, except separating the culture and rennet additions by an hour, i usually dump everything at once. milk handling is good, etc.

thanks!


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## Rose (Oct 26, 2007)

When this happened to me, I was told e. coli, and to throw it out. I did.


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## Sondra (Oct 25, 2007)

yep throw it out somewhere and was probably with the clabboring stage you got some nasties


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## mulish (Apr 26, 2009)

believe me, it's not staying!


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## linuxboy (Oct 26, 2009)

Coliform and e. coli are common CO2 producing contaminants. Sometimes despite our best efforts it happens. Maybe it was in the air on a dust particle. Maybe it got sucked into the airstream in the milk machine. Maybe it was hiding in the bottom of the teat, and even though you fore stripped, wiped, and dipped, some still got in. 

What I'm trying to say is that even if we practice the best possible milk handling and udder treatment, this sometimes happens, but should not be commonplace with proper sanitation. Good for you for using your nose and tossing it . If this keeps happening, then it's a bigger indicator that you should try to trace it to a root cause because it may be systemic.


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## mulish (Apr 26, 2009)

i have to suspect the clabber/something in the air on this, as milking practice, milk, etc. were the same as the other 3 batches of delicious chevre i made this week. unless there is something in my storebought culture that would edge out the bad guys (coliform) given the same practices.

sorry if i'm just not getting it here, but here are a couple more clabber questions: 
jar to culture in: my dishwasher has a high-heat sani-rinse cycle that all milk/cheese associated tools, containers go through & typically go straight from there to being used.
clabber process: i'm looking for the moment that there is a solid mass/separation of liquids/solids in milk and then using immediately or refrigerating to stop any growth. what should it smell like at this point? (i noticed that it did not have a cheesy smell then, and wondered if it should have.)
are both the liquids and solids of clabber added to milk at temperature?

thanks again!


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## Ziggy (Nov 13, 2009)

I would consider sanitizing even after the dishwasher. Also I am wondering if you are using plastic as opposed to stainless. If you are using plastic little cuts and scrapes in the plastic can harbor all kinds of germs.

I know there are now FDA approved plastic milking buckets but I am a firm believer in stainless steel.


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## mulish (Apr 26, 2009)

aside from some plastic cheese molds for certain cheeses, everything that touches the milk is stainless or glass - i'm a big believer in it too! the dishwasher cycle is not a typical one - here's what the literature says: NSF® Certified Sani Rinse™ option sanitizes dishes by eliminating 99.999% of food soil bacteria, as certified by NSF International.

thanks!


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## Ziggy (Nov 13, 2009)

Sounds like you just got a bad batch of milk then, Better luck next time.


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## Bernice (Apr 2, 2009)

Sounds like what happens when I save milk and then someone moves it to the back forty of the fridge! Nasty stuff!


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## nightskyfarm (Sep 7, 2009)

Bacteria is everywhere and not matter how clean you think you are, it can find a way to get into your cheese. I agree with Ziggy and Pav. Pay extra attention to milk handling, milk cooling and sanitize all equipment with bleach rinse. Try, try again, but do not consume that cheese. It can also be yeast which is everywhere. e.coli will not necessarily make spongey curd.


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