# Pulsator Question - Surge Milker



## Pronking Publius (Mar 29, 2012)

Well, I finally got around to assembling all the various parts I bought a few weeks ago to make a surge milker and I'm having a little trouble with the pulsator. I'm trying to figure out if it is broke, or if I just need to adjust it or clean it somehow....thing is, I don't really even know how it works. You can see what it looks like in the picture I posted. First of all, I'm not sure what the little twisting dial does at the bottom right, by the hoses. I assume it regulates the frequency of the pulsations, but I'm just assuming that. When I bought the bucket, it also came with that pin that is laying on the ground next to the pulsator. What in the world is that for? Is that supposed to be slipped into the top of the lid under the pulsator while the machine is being used or no? I've tried adjusting the knob by the hoses. There should have been enough pressure to make the pulsator kick in...I had it somewhere between 12-14 HG. So everything seems to be working except for the darn pulsator. Eventually I'm going to be getting the Interpuls that Vicki was suggesting, but in the meantime I'm trying to get this to work, or at least see if it works. Can someone tell me what those few parts are on the pulsator and how that pin is used? And any suggestions on something I'm missing to get it to kick in? Thanks.


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## C-Daner (Apr 12, 2013)

Have you checked this website out? http://www.surgemilker.com/instructions.html


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

12 to 14 may not be enough to get it to kick in, tighten down it's screw to see if it will kick in. With the flap lifted you should see the slides moving back and forth, then slow it down to the 12 beats per minute or whatever it is, I quit counting with the interpulse  So yes tighten down the twistie thing, to make it pump faster and kick in. 

Can you raise your pressure, do you have airleaks, make sure everything is closed, it maybe need more vacuum to initially run, and you need more vacuum anyway, so that when you are milking, any air leaks around the inflations, shutoffs, etc...and you are going to have air leaks, don't bring the vacuum down below 12. 

No idea about your pin, I didn't have a surge lid, just a surge pulsator and can. I would assume the pin has to be in the lid, or you would once again lose vacuum.

Nicole will know. Vicki


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## Goat Town (Nov 20, 2010)

Matt,

First off the rate adjustment screw is way too far out for it to work. You need to screw it all the way down and back it off a turn or so. Secondly the pulsator will not run off the bucket unless you put your thumb over the hole where the pulsator attaches to the lid. The metal pin looks like a check valve though I've not seen one like that since the last S type machine I serviced. There should be a metal pin with a rubber tip that fits into the hole in the lid where the pulsator mounts. The last time I looked at the site referenced above, those service documents were no longer there. I have them stored on my computer if you need them.


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## Pronking Publius (Mar 29, 2012)

I appreciate all the help. I will have to look at it again and troubleshoot a bit here sometime in the next few days. Thanks.


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## Pronking Publius (Mar 29, 2012)

Nicole, I'm still not too sure on what a check valve is. I think it is a check valve that I have, but it didn't have a rubber tip on it, and I still don't understand what it is used for. When you were talking about a rubber tip, was the rubber tip supposed to go on that? I don't get what its supposed to do. If there is a valve with a plug on it that the pulsator sits on and it plugs the hole to the bucket, then wouldn't there be zero suction being created since the go-between between the pump and the bucket? I'm not questioning your experience with this, I'm just saying there must be something I am missing here in my comprehension of this. The way it came, and it is used, is around the base of the stem (which is on the lid), which I believe is an "s", there is some electrical tape wrapped a few times. I know that is sort of rigged, but it seems to work fine pressure-wise. I'm getting 15 HG with the pulsator sitting on the stem that way without that valve thing in (which again, I still don't understand). So I still don't get that stem thing...what its for. I didn't quite understand your post on that. I have adjusted that knob that controls the frequency of the pulsations. I have also taken the pulsator off the lid and closed the hole on the inside of the underside of the pulsator where the pulsator sits on the lid, which caused the pressure to really go up, but it still didn't kick in. I put the pulsator by the fire for a few minutes to warm it up and see if that would help loosen up some of the components. No go there as well. Short of taking it all apart, and I don't have a replacement kit, so I'm not sure what the point of that would be, I'm not sure what else to do. I just wonder if I'm not configuring something wrong because, as I said, the pulsator is just sitting on the stem/lid without that check valve, but again, the pressure seems to be there. I've put that little valve in and run it and taken it out and run it and the pressure seems to be adequate both ways, but the pulsator isn't kicking in. I'm just confused....can you tell?


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## Goat Town (Nov 20, 2010)

I suppose we need to determine what type of pulsator you have first. On the bottom of the pulsator there should be a serial number. If the number begins with an "S" you have a very old "S" type pulsator which will only work with an "S" type lid. "S" type lids have the check valve installed in the lid and you cannot remove it. "S" type pulsators and lids were discontinued in the early 1950s. 

Now if the serial number begins with a "C" then you have a "newer" "C" type pulsator. A "C" type pulsator will also have a clean out port covered by a screw on the bottom of the pulsator. "C" type pulsators only work with "C" type lids because the pulsator mounts differently than "S" types. "C" type lids have a removable check valve with a rubber tip and require a rubber O ring on the stem under the pulsator. Just as a historical note Surge discontinued making this stuff in 1999.

Regardless of what type pulsator you have you should be able to manually push the slides back and forth with your finger. If you can do that, use short pieces of tubing to connect each set of air nipples. Hook the pulsator up to your vacuum pump and with the pump running cover the hole on the bottom of the pulsator with your thumb and see if it runs. It should run with 8 to 10 inches of vacuum. If it doesn't then the pulsator will need to be disassembled, cleaned, and rebuilt.


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## Pronking Publius (Mar 29, 2012)

It's an S type pulsator, but there isn't a check valve in the lid of the bucket...I don't think. I'll attach a picture of what the lid looks like where it attaches to the pulsator. Hopefully that picture is close enough. That hole in the lid has a little notched indent on one side. Perhaps I have an S pulsator and a C lid? I thought the lid was an S lid from looking at some other sites. It DOES seal when the vacuum is on, but perhaps why it isn't working is it is attached wrong and needs the valve in or something? That's why I was trying to figure out what the valve thing does and how it works. I have that valve in the top picture, but there was no rubber tip on it like you explained, and I don't see how or what it would do if it were slid in under the pulsator on the lid. I've tried it in and when it was out, but I don't get what it does. I know this should be simpler, but I have no experience in this. AHH!! Sorry.


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## Blackbird (Jan 11, 2013)

I am using the "C", so my advice may not be helpful, but regardless of the fact that I think there is always enough suction, I have to press down on the lid to seal it correctly, and manually start the slides.


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## Goat Town (Nov 20, 2010)

That's an S type lid. Forget the check valve. The machine will run with or without it. Did you try running the pulsator off the lid as I suggested?


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## Pronking Publius (Mar 29, 2012)

Nicole, Yep. I've tried different pressures, different frequencies with that knob, I've run it on the lid, I've run it off the lid and put my finger over the hole which REALLY made the pressure jump. I oiled the leathers yesterday and still nadda. I did unscrew it and took a look before oiling it. I didn't clean it really. I just wanted to see how it worked. One of the pistons moves back and forth when I manually move it with the vacuum on, and when I move it, the other piston moved. But then when I try and manually move the other one when the vacuum is on it seems to have suction so that when I try and move it it just gets sucked back into place....if that makes any sense. At any rate, I can't think of anything else to do besides cleaning it real well or getting a rebuild kit, but I have my doubts as to whether cleaning it will work since the pistons never move at all unless manually moved. I contacted the seller, and it sound like he will be sending another pulsator out, hopefully. I don't think it will be in time though for my girls who are due any day, so I may try cleaning it out in the meantime, but again, I have my doubts. Thanks so much for the help, especially with identifying it as an S lid and letting me know I don't need the check valve....I didn't think I needed it...that's why I was so confused, well, part of the reason.


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## Goat Town (Nov 20, 2010)

Well, cleaning it and putting a rebuild kit in it might solve the problems. It could be that the valves are not installed correctly or that there's a problem with the speed adjustment needle valve.


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## Pronking Publius (Mar 29, 2012)

....by the way, the seller sent me a replacement and with ALL my screwing around with the one I was referring to, this one cranked right up no problem. I don't know what it was in the pulsator, but it was the pulsator.


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