# secret ingedient



## todog (Dec 10, 2011)

Does anyone have a "secret ingredient" in their soap and if so do u list it on the ingredients list on the label? Just wondering!


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## Anita Martin (Dec 26, 2007)

I think special ingredients should never be "secret" they are what will help sell your soap...things such as shea butter, herbs, dead sea salts, etc. Customers appreciate honesty and buy our handmade soaps because they know what is in them. And usually having a special ingredient in a soap only adds to label appeal.


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## Faye Farms (Sep 14, 2009)

There's too many people who *need* to know what is on the label to leave something out.


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## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

Anita Martin said:


> I think special ingredients should never be "secret" they are what will help sell your soap...things such as shea butter, herbs, dead sea salts, etc. Customers appreciate honesty and buy our handmade soaps because they know what is in them. And usually having a special ingredient in a soap only adds to label appeal.


 :yeahthat

And......



Faye Farms said:


> There's too many people who *need* to know what is on the label to leave something out.


 :yeahthat

Also, according to the FDA regs (I think), if you list ONE ingredient, you need to list them all.

I list them all and I call the lye, sodium hydroxide. I don't try to hide it with wording such as sodium lardate, sodium cocoate, etc.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

It's soap, unless you make cosmetic claims, you don't need to list anything. There is no rules if you decide to list a few, because once the saponification process is over, it's soap. Let's not pretend that anything comes across the sap process except the quality of your recipe. Hardness, moisturising, bubbles etc.... and even then many of those things are perceived.


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## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

Yes, Vicki, I know you don't HAVE to list the ingredients. But if you list one, you need to list all. Thought I read that in the regs, as little as there are.


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2008)

MF-Alpines said:


> Yes, Vicki, I know you don't HAVE to list the ingredients. But if you list one, you need to list all. Thought I read that in the regs, as little as there are.


Ummm...I don't think so. ??? Maybe it varies by state. ? When I was researching for my Non-Scents Odor Remover soap, I'd check out similar soaps in local bait shops/hunting/sporting goods stores. One listed ingredients, BUT clearly stated on the label that there were *secret* ingredients in it that removed odor. Nothing in the list of ingredients would have removed odor, other than being plain old soap.

I have thought about omitting *secret* ingredients like that, but like someone else said-label appeal. And I put alot of work into those *special* soaps, so I want people to know just WHY they're special.


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## hsmomof4 (Oct 31, 2008)

Just because someone does or doesn't do something, doesn't mean that they are actually following whatever rules there might be. I mean, there's a soap down at our feed store that is labeled as helping arthritis, psoriasis, etc. You can buy it there, online, and tons of other places, I'm sure. They are not even close to following the rules for that OTC drug that they're selling (because that's what making all of those claims has turned that soap into).


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Oh I am not saying it's right or wrong, all I am saying is that the 'if you list one you have to list them all' is in the regs, unless they have changed them, it is not. There are no listing regs, because in the end everything is just soap. Our listing of ingredients is pure marketing.


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## hsmomof4 (Oct 31, 2008)

It does seem to be a gray area wrt labeling. Obviously, if you claim, in any way, that your soap will do anything other than get you clean, it doesn't fall under soap regulations any more. So, if you say that it's moisturizing, it's a cosmetic. If you say that it will cure someone's psoriasis, it's a drug. Not sure what saying that it is odor removing does. 

My issue with including some ingredients and not others, or with putting them in something other than descending order by weight, is that 1) it could be misleading (like if I put some oil up at the top of my list because it's a special, expensive oil, but I actually only used a tiny bit for label appeal, I don't think it's fair to make people think that it's a main ingredient), and 2) someone could be allergic to something that I put in my soap. Sure, it's all soap now, but I am unwilling to take a chance that someone with a deathly allergy to, oh, almonds, say, would absolutely not react to a soap with almond oil in it, and I would want them to know what is in it.


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## NPgoats (Mar 18, 2010)

hsmomof4 said:


> Just because someone does or doesn't do something, doesn't mean that they are actually following whatever rules there might be. I mean, there's a soap down at our feed store that is labeled as helping arthritis, psoriasis, etc. You can buy it there, online, and tons of other places, I'm sure. They are not even close to following the rules for that OTC drug that they're selling (because that's what making all of those claims has turned that soap into).


I've been told that when you make any kind of a "medical claim" (helps arthritis, psoriasis, etc.) then your product what ever it is falls under specific regulations. But people do it all the time (whether it is because they don't care or don't know) until they are challenged on it by a government agency and then they have to conform with whatever penalties it brings. 
It also brings up a point on allergies. I check the lables on a lot of things because I'm allergic to chocolate. I'd be in a mess if they didn't label it. But once it's soap after the chemical change...hmm I don't know if it would bother me. I'm not a chemist or a doctor...and I'm too chicken to try the Hot Chocolate soap! LOL Linda


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Linda, want me to send you a bar of my new, Let Them Eat Cake, cocoa butter, cocoa powder and white chocolate curls? (OK the white chocolate curls aren't really chocolate


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Stacey, I just don't let what others do bother me. Nowhere does it say to put them in any kind of order, not on cosmetic labels either. We are policed in the end by our customers and ourselves, we can't control anything past that.


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## hsmomof4 (Oct 31, 2008)

Actually, Vicki, it does say that you have to put them in a particular order on cosmetic labels. From the FDA's website, http://www.fda.gov/Cosmetics/CosmeticLabelingLabelClaims/CosmeticLabelingManual/ucm126438.htm in the paragraph entitled "Declaration of Ingredients":



> The ingredients *must be declared in descending order of predominance.* Color additives (21 CFR 701.3(f)(3)) and ingredients present at one percent or less (21 CFR 701.3(f)(2)) may be declared without regard for predominance. The ingredients must be identified by the names established or adopted by regulation (21 CFR 701.3(c)); those accepted by the FDA as exempt from public disclosure may be stated as "and other ingredients" (21 CFR 701.3(a)).


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## todog (Dec 10, 2011)

Wow do I know how to stir the puddin! LOL. The only reason I asked the question, was a tv show about a certain person who raises dairy goats and made soap with a secret ingredient. I list everything on my ladels except for the beer soap because if you brew beer you don't have to list ingredients. I just list the name and maker of the beer.


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## NPgoats (Mar 18, 2010)

Haha Vicki I'll pass on the "Cake" soap. But I have wondered if I would react to it. LOL I keep envisioning myself turning into a blow fish dipped in red dry! Lol 

Hey Todog...beer soap, that sounds interesting. Want to share the reason for beer? I'm new to soaping so I'm full of why's, what for's, and how come's. Lol That's how I learn! Linda


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## todog (Dec 10, 2011)

Hey Linda. That's how I learned too! No real reason for the beer soap except they make so many different ones like the blueberry I made 2 wks. ago and the chocolate beer from england. My daughter finds all the weird beers and she will try them and then tell me which ones she would like to see made into soap. I don't drink but I get some sideways looks when at the grocery getting excited about some new beers. I did taste the blueberry and it was yucky. Lol


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## NPgoats (Mar 18, 2010)

LOL I'm not a drinker either but have lots of friends that are. I might have to get some of your beer soap as gifts. Linda


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## In it for the Bucks! (Mar 12, 2012)

My BF loves his beer (Keystone) He has been drinking it before it was cool. lol We don't have tv and everyone keeps bringing up all the crazy comercials. We have no idea what they are talking about. lol (I can't stand beer unless is it in an irish car bombhe has a few friends that are die hard Keystone drinkers and I have really thought about doing a beer soap. Is there anything different that you need to do. Like let the beer sit so it's not bubbly. or add it at trace or emultion (sp?)??


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## Sheryl (Oct 27, 2007)

the beer must be flat or you will have one terrific volocano with the lye. If the beer is not flat, you have to cook it till al lthe alcohol is out. I think it is on the soapmakingforum that I read some posts about several soap makers making beer soap. I saw some pretty ones. I have made one, and have plans for more. It is my only "non" goat milk soap. It is supposed to be a creamy soap. I haven't tried mine yet.

sheryl


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## hsmomof4 (Oct 31, 2008)

I just freeze it like I do all of my other liquids. I always use frozen something to dissolve my lye (fewer fumes that way, helps keep things cool) and add milk later, so I do beer soaps the same way.


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## todog (Dec 10, 2011)

Cally, I put the beer in the fridge open for about three days. I replace all the liquid with the beer. Freezing it would work too. I do the same with the coffee soap. Cold or frozen coffee.


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