# what is a good milk amount per day



## feistymomma (May 20, 2009)

I was wondering what is a good average amount for a doe to milk per day. My Nubian doe is a 3 yr old 2nd Freshener. She is milking twice a day and is milking a little under 3/4 of a gallon. For a family milker, would you say that this is OK? I know that many does mik over a gallon a day. She has a beautiful udder and I think she has more capacity than what she is giving me.


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## fmg (Jul 4, 2011)

http://adga.org/index.php?option=co...eedavg&catid=46:production-testing&Itemid=200 This will show the average over an entire lactation for the different breeds. And this http://adga.org/index.php?option=co...ctcomp&catid=46:production-testing&Itemid=200 shows daily amounts by breed.

Most give around a gallon per day, but it also depends A LOT on when she freshened. How long into lactation is she?


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## doublebowgoats (Mar 6, 2008)

You kinda have to decide what is good for your own farm. For me, I just can't stand it when I get less than a gallon a day from a standard size milker. 
I have a large mini that is giving around 7lbs a day, but her milkfat and protein is awesome and produce more cheese per pound of milk than other goats. She is healthy and in good condition without any pampering, so I keep her. 
On the other hand, when a doe here produces less with the same management as the rest of the herd, I get rid of them.


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## feistymomma (May 20, 2009)

She freshened March 1st. I think she should be milking more but I can't seem to get her to milk more. I have upped grain ( I am only feeding a 12%, so maybe try a 16%?), she gets alfalfa pellets, hay and browse.


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## doublebowgoats (Mar 6, 2008)

Do you know how much she produced her first freshening? If she has produced more in the past, I would do a thorough check, like fecal, temp, milk culture and see where she stands.


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## SherrieC (Oct 26, 2007)

I know here, from a second freshener I want at least a gallon a day, and 10 lbs from the third fresheners, plus good disposition, eye appeal, show quality. Bloodlines I can work with. If I didn't cull so hard I would have 50 + goats in no time. 
For you though, if she passes all your other criteria, since she is new to your farm, you have to give her a break for that it takes them awhile to settle in. I would say get more picky with her on her amount next year.


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## feistymomma (May 20, 2009)

She produced about a 1/2 gallon a day last year, so i guess she is increasing. I am keeping a log of milk weights so i can gauge if she us gong up or down, so I guess I am conducting my own milk test. I am fine with the amount she is giving, but I just think she could do better and I would like her to meet her potential.


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## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

Your original post asked "for a family milker". Your fine. Could you expect more? Sure. But without details as to upbringing, management, etc., it would be hard to say. That 3/4 gallon could be great! Just depends.


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## Anita Martin (Dec 26, 2007)

I feed a higher percent of protein, all they can eat two times a day, plus alfalfa pellets two times per day. I don't measure either one and if I didn't have chickens running in the paddocks I'd leave out more alfalfa. I have alpines and I do think that they need more feed than other breeds to milk and to keep body condition. I'm definately not suggesting you make radical dietary changes, but I know that the better my hay is, the more the girls will milk, and when I've used a 12% by-product feed in the past, I got a lot less milk. Much less milk. My alfalfa pellets right now have way too much pellet dust and grains in them, and they don't like them very well so they have gone down in production. When they go out on the new pasture in the spring, they milk much more while the pasture is succulant. 

So many things can affect a lactation. Stress is huge. Is your doe stressed? Does anyone beat up on her? How about her water? Most goats like extremely clean water and sometimes will not drink much if it becomes green or dirty....water affects production.

How much are your other does milking right now?


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## Ziggy (Nov 13, 2009)

I like to see my first fresheners give a gallon a day at peak but if I like their confirmation and attitude I will wait to see what they produce at 2 years old and second freshening. We are on milk test and you can see our weights on my FB farm page at http://www.facebook.com/SunriseFarmNC


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## LLB101 (Sep 29, 2009)

Interesting, there's quite a range of expectations here!

Some expect a gallon from a FF, some from a 2nd etc. 

I guess I'm really surprised and maybe need to adjust my expectations. 3 of 6 mini-manchas here milk a gallon or more at peak, 2 of them as FF, the other 3 are close 7 lbs-ish, and these does average 85 lbs... y'all are talking about expectations for standard dairy goats, right? Maybe I need to revisit data on averages...


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## swgoats (May 21, 2010)

Lacia your minis are doing phenomenal! I'd be happy with 4 lbs for a first freshener mini. Of course Nubians milk less than LaManchas, so would expect the same with minis. I'm hoping to see numbers more like your with my own first crosses, since I've tried to buy better foundation stock. It'll be two years before I even get to see that, so for now just pushing the minis I got to do their best.


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## Ziggy (Nov 13, 2009)

Yes those numbers sound amazing for a mini. I was referring to full size breed - Alpines and Nubians.


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## feistymomma (May 20, 2009)

She is given fresh water twice a day and the water bucket is scrubbed out every other day. Right now I don't have anyone I can compare her to. My other does will not freshen until the end of May, and they will all be FF. She's not stressed I wouldn't think. She is not in the same pen as the other does, but are right next to them for the reason that they were being kind of mean to her. I really didn't want a bunch of head butting matches between my pregnant does and my milking doe. She acts like she is very happy go lucky. I am thinking about switching her to a 16% mix. Her milk is just wonderful and I want her to milk at her full potential. 


Ziggy- I follow your facebook page  Your goats are amazing. I was telling my husband about your numbers and he was just floored! I strive to have goats like yours!!


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## Ziggy (Nov 13, 2009)

Thanks so much for those compliments Amber. We do work hard at it but the key is good genetics and good hay and a regular routine. we are very consistent in our milking times - 12 hours apart and try to never vary that by more than 15 minutes unless we are at a show and even then the ones at home get milked on schedule by my very reliable backup Milker who is a FFA girl in high school.


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## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

If everyone will be honest Amber that is decent and pretty average for a Nubian unless you have her feed regime down perfectly for maximum production- dairy alfalfa for bulk and high protein ration and other additives to boost milk factors and not a mouthful wasted on anything that is not directed at making milk.

More is not always better if you don't bring in money from your milk or stock sales to pay for top notch feeding- it's not cheap. A nice long level lactation with a doe keeping good condition all year is a valuable thing. If you like her udder structure and want to keep her then maybe tweak her feeding and see if it increases production without affecting her negatively otherwise. Perhaps do Vicki's "challenge feeding" add a cup of grain and if her production rises in 2 weeks add another cup of grain (or ration) at each milking and repeat until her totals stop rising. Once she stops increasing then stop adding extra feed.(I have forgotten what you feed). Watch for acidity and go slowly with increases. But like many have mentioned it is the quality of the bulk you feed that will determine your outcome. Breeding plays a huge role and so if feed changes do not affect her output then she is milking to capacity. Just breed her to a buck from a milky line and hope for increases with her doelings.
In the meantime enjoy a healthy well made doe that milks a decent amount without great expense or health problems  
Lee


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## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

And Amber do not- do not- just jump from 12 to 16 % feed.
If you choose to do this mix a quarter of the new ration into 3/4 the old and increase the percentage until you have changed over during an extended timeframe. Like a month or 6 weeks.
No radical changes or you will be doctoring a sick rumen with no milk :/

First try just increasing what she has been used to. 
Another idea is to top dress what she is used to with some protein kicker like soy meal. 
Start slow- go slow with any changes.

Is she in good flesh? What is her body condition?
L


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## feistymomma (May 20, 2009)

Her body contition is really good. She is maintaining a good weight and looks great. Thank you for the tips Lee. I should have mentioned that I would gradually add in the 16%. I try to be very careful on what I feed my goats. I weigh and write down everything, and if I do change something, I do it gradually and right down the increases. With everything else I have to do, I would forget from one day to the next how much of something I gave them! lol! I am going to try to increase by a cup every 2 weeks like you said with the 12% for a while to see if she increases any. I am also going to increase her alfalfa pellets a little more. I am happy with her. She is able to provide milk for my doeling and milk for us to use ourselves. I know she will never be a 5* milker.


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## LLB101 (Sep 29, 2009)

Lee, fabulous advice and reminders to all of us! Vicki's challenge is a good idea too.

I know mini's that are actually milking more than mine and often make me feel bad about mine! And I hear about a lot who say "great milker" for significantly less milk, so its a bit confusing. 

I also think its important to think about milk for the size of the doe. My smallest was milking less in literal pounds than my largest, but a bigger amount as a percentage of her body weight. So to me, that said she might actually have better producing milk genes. That's part of why I'm sooooooooo disapointed in her daughter's FF last week... sire has milk milk milk, and then daughter has single kid and not much milk relative our normal here. And I'm back to not knowing how much is genetic dice roll and how much is single kid effect.

Anyway, on size... how many of you have the most milk from the bigger milkers, or do you have some smaller girls that milk proportionately more for their size? Obviously there's some positive relationship, but how closely do you think size tracks to milk for your does?


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## Ziggy (Nov 13, 2009)

A single will definitely affect output. My top Nubian is down roughly 20 percent in production this year versus last. She had a big single buck this year.


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## swgoats (May 21, 2010)

What do you consider a good ratio of production to size? Are you looking at height or weight/width?


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## doublebowgoats (Mar 6, 2008)

With the minis, I tend to look at the overall size, not really height. My mini that is short but weighs the same as most standards better be producing close to standard production, or in my doe's case, have butterfat and protein levels that make it worthwhile. I have milked a 65 lb doe (not mine) that was producing a quart at each milking. I consider that good.
Of course, with the standard does, I will look more at feed conversion, since they are all closer to the same size. As far as actual ratios, that would involve more math than I am willing to do at this time.


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## [email protected] (Sep 18, 2008)

Mine are milking EXTREMELY well (IMO) this year. I don't know why, but I ain't changin' nothin'! 

ZeeZee (3yr old 3rd freshener--03/06 with trips) is milking 10-11#/day. Big doe (for here). Milked 6#/day at peak last year and as a FF.
May (2yr old 2nd freshener--03/14 with twins) is milking 8#/day. Small doe, soccer ball udder. Milked 4-5#/day last year (FF).
Bug (2yr old FF--03/15 with single) is milking 6#/day. Big doe--taller than her dam (ZeeZee) and I think should be milking more. I do think having the single kid has something to do with it. She has a nice udder (could be higher in the rear and seems like she could *fill* it more). She has earned a *stay* til next year....unless I ship her off on personality conflict--great with me and on the stand, mean to other does.  
Kindle (5yr old 4th freshener--02/06 with trips-one DOA) is the only exception. She's milking about 6#/day.  She didn't freshen here though, and we had that incident with the dogfood that dropped her to less than 4#/day for a couple of weeks.


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## LLB101 (Sep 29, 2009)

I consider the relevant size to be their good condition, pre-pregnancy weight. I try to get them weighed on a scale in the fall before breeding. 

When I do, I also weight tape them and record both so I have an idea how accurate the tape is for that doe. The tape's been within 10% with one exception, my 3/4 ND who has a lot of body capacity, just on ND legs. Not elegant overall but very nice udder, good producer, great feed converter, great cheese yield, regular entertainment antics... she earns her keep.

Being me  I've also weighed some of them soon post kidding. The ones that gain the most pre to post breeding are the FF, probably duh...

So that's what I base the doe weight to production ratio on.

Mine range here from 65-95 lbs. That's almost a 50% difference. Bigger range than I've heard from most standard breeders. How many of you out there have range of does from 130 to 190 lbs?

So I calculate what percentage of her weight that a doe is producing. 

Anything above 10% at peak I'm happy with. So for comparison, that would be 15 lbs for your standard size 150 lb miker, or just shy of 2 gallons per day at peak.

I've been getting some feedback that my standards might not be so reasonable :biggrin

But most of mine have made it, so I'm not too happy with the few that don't.

Besides peak, I calculate at 6 months fresh, at breeding date, and 305 day percentages, and 305 day as a percentage of peak milk. Pretty interesting! Around 6 months is the tipping point, before that the big peakers have more, after that some drop and some don't and they wind up with higher 305 day percentages. I think that's the number I'm most interested in. But my ideas are still evolving.

And no, I don't have to do the math, Excel spreadsheet does it for me once I set it up. I'm willing to help anyone who wants help with that, if I have time when you need it.


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## swgoats (May 21, 2010)

My full grown Mini Nubians range from 80-120 lbs. The 120 lb does are over height for IDGR. OK for MDGA. We are not a show herd or a commercial dairy. We are just breeders of a particular product. I think there is a market for 80 lb does that milk 1/2-3/4 a gallon. We have a family of five, and 1/2 a gallon of milk a day and we are swimming in it. So I guess I'm happy with 5-7%. But hey, if you've achieved that 10%, and it is what you want, I do not think it is unreasonable to stick to it! 

I'm not sure what the % is for production difference between standard LaManchas and Nubians. I would expect to see a difference between the minis too. I can't wait to butterfat test mine.


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## Golden Delta Alpines (Mar 8, 2012)

So is 10-11 pounds a day good for a fourth freshener? That's how much my Alpine gives, and she had twins March 4th.


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## Ziggy (Nov 13, 2009)

I think 10-11 pounds is probably fine for a home Milker - you have to remember to look at what your needs are and what you are looking to achieve. I think most people would be happy with a goat that can give them over a gallon a day.

If you are looking to win shows volume is less important than conformation especially with the US method of no mandatory milk outs (except at Nationals). I know for a fact that there are many does out there with CH or evn GCHs that milk less than a gallon (8 pounds) a day.

Obviously 10 pounds is not going to get you anywhere near top 10 but is is certainly acceptable - in fact admirable - especially of that doe can keep that leve for the better part of 305 days or longer as that would make her a 3000 pound plus Milker.. If she only freshened a month ago her volume should be increasing for the next couple of months.


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## Golden Delta Alpines (Mar 8, 2012)

How much do the top ten milkers give a day?


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## Ziggy (Nov 13, 2009)

Well with Alpines you probably need to be close to 4500 pounds - so on average over 15 pounds per day...the 2010 numbers are here http://www.adga.org/index.php?option=com_wrapper&view=wrapper&Itemid=207


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## MayLOC (Oct 26, 2007)

I agree with looking at what your needs are and what you wish to achieve.
Then I also would look at what you are putting into your does to achieve that output. And how long they can maintain it for a year and for a lifetime. 
Look at some of the dairy cows that pump it out. They push the feed to them and they do pump it out... for a few years.
Some does have to be babied and topped with a little of this and more of that and are high maintenence to achieve X amount of milk.
Some does milk well with less. Some milk well and then shut off after a few months. Some does just don't milk and put it all into their figures. Different breeds are meant to do different things. And to compare different breeds is like comparing apples to oranges, isn't it?

There are a lot of variables and everybody is looking for something different.
There are a lot of breeds on this board and you can bet there are a lot that milk well.
And they are all in different circumstances and under different caregivers with owners desiring different things.

Not that it matters at all, but for me... I want a healthy doe that milks well for a full year. I don't want to have to baby her and I want her to last for many years and be in good health and flesh year round. Can and do some of mine go beyond that, yes, but it isn't my goal.


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## Golden Delta Alpines (Mar 8, 2012)

Wow, 15 pounds is alot!


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## swgoats (May 21, 2010)

Really!! I was so excited my little 80 lber hit her 4 lbs today. Not bad for 1 lb of 12% sweet mix!


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