# Pasture Seed???



## Daniel Babcock (May 28, 2008)

This week I will be planting my pastures, they have been fallow for 40 years. I contacted my local extension agent and this is the mixture he suggested:

I would suggest that you plant a mixture of Meadow Bromegrass, Orchardgrass and White Clover at a rate of 12, 8 and 2 pounds respectively. I would make no differentiation between the sunny and shady areas.

I live in Utah so it is pretty dry, however I have pressurized irrigation throughout my property.

What other recommendations would you have?

How long does it take for a pasture to mature?

Do I need to keep the goats off of it until next spring?

thanks in advance!


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## homeacremom (Nov 6, 2007)

Now I thought white clover could be toxic. :?


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## Anita Martin (Dec 26, 2007)

It's a mystery to me why they put clover in pasture seed for horses too, since when they eat it they slobber like a rabid wolf. And anything that makes them look that disgusting can't be good for them. They sure do like it though. Figure it must be cheaper than those other seeds and maybe acts as a filler for the bag?
Anita


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## Daniel Babcock (May 28, 2008)

As I understand it, white clover is a legume like alf-alfa, it replenishes the soil with nitrogen and is very healthy for livestock?


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## Sondra (Oct 25, 2007)

> The foliage and seedheads are eaten by such upland gamebirds as the Ruffed Grouse, Greater Prairie Chicken, Wild Turkey, and Ring-Necked Pheasant. Some songbirds occasionally eat the seeds, including the Horned Lark and Smith Longspur (winter only). Various small mammals find the foliage and seedpods very attractive as a source of food, including the Cottontail Rabbit, Groundhog, Thirteen-Lined Ground Squirrel, and Meadow Vole. Large hoofed animals, such as the White-Tailed Deer, cattle, horses, and sheep, also graze on the foliage of clovers. If it is eaten in large amounts, however, White Clover can be toxic because it contains a glycoside that converts to prussic acid when the foliage is eaten by animals. However, cultivated strains of White Clover have been developed that are without this glycoside. The ecological value of White Clover to wildlife is high. It is also an important source of honey to humans.


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## Daniel Babcock (May 28, 2008)

I will verify that this white clover is a cultivated strain developed without glycoside. Why not plant alf-alfa instead?

Thanks


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## Guest (Sep 18, 2008)

Moderation is the key here......if you put your goats on a solid clover field and offer them nothing else to eat but clover, you will run into problems.
A dab of this and a dab of that is what I am for at my place.

Personally....if this was my pasture, and it is 40 years wild....I would only strip disk/plant about tractor width strips through it, and leave about 20ft or so of "wild" between those strips. I would value that weedy type junk that is gonna naturally come in between those strips.......maybe even let a little fertilizer hit it too.

About this time of the year, I would bushhog a few of those wild strips...very lightly disc it, and then overseed it with winter ryegrass and ryegrain...maybe oats and wheat too. Do not disk this to much or you will kill out the naturals that come back yearly.....just scratch it up enough to get some reasonable seed to soil contact is all.

JMO,

Whim


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## SALTCREEK_Nubians_Linda (Nov 13, 2007)

White clover is toxic if it's the least bit wilted. (botany major here) And Horses will eat Loco Weed too, get addicted to it and seek it out to eat more of it. That doesn't mean it is good for them. It is very bad for them. I'd plant alfalfa, wich is what I am going to do next Spring.


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## Haglerfarm (Aug 11, 2008)

I overseed my pastures each spring with clover. A mixture of white (ladina?), red and sometimes crimson. The white clover is a tall clover, not the short stuff. My goats won't eat that kind.
My normal pasture is old fescue with endophyte. The clover helps to counteract the fescue and adds nitrogen to the soil, improving it. Alfalfa does not do well here at all. No one grows it. I have also added Rye that comes up quickly. I have in the past also added orchardgrass, but it did not do well. I also have added Lespedeza, can't remember if it was Korean or Kobe, but it did not do well either. The clover does well usually, but these summers of drought it all dies. Except for a few spots of some sort of bermuda. The goats do not like it as it is very tough. When it is mown it just sort of chews it off and it frays.
My favorite is serecia, but the goats eat it down first. I am hoping to put some of it in our hay field this next year. Our ground here is very poor and serecia does well on it.
Les


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## Bella Star (Oct 27, 2007)

Can Lespedeza be planted now in Texas ? How about a deer grass mix ? 

Is it better to plant these in fall or spring ?


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## stoneyheightsfarm (Jan 19, 2008)

We live on a giant limestone hill, so various species of clover are thick through our yard. I've even thrown out alfalfa seed and had it spring up without much effort. Anyhow, my goats sniff at it and then don't want a thing to do with it. They're all about the redbud and maple trees! What's going on with that? Wrong season? Too much alfalfa hay? Just a preference for "eating up"?


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## SALTCREEK_Nubians_Linda (Nov 13, 2007)

Well yeah!  If a goat can eat a tree, man, that's just ambrosia. Or a rosebush. They are natural browsers, not just grazers. When they get hungry though, don't they fall to grazing some? Mine do, Eventually. If they can get into my yard and eat the bark off my fruit trees then they think they are in heaven though. :sigh


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## SALTCREEK_Nubians_Linda (Nov 13, 2007)

serecia?! Noooooooo :nooo Up here we are in a battle for the pastures because of serecia. :crazy It is carried all over by birds, it takes over and crowds out all the native grasses and plants so there is nothing left for cattle to graze. Yes, i have goats. they do eat the serecia but they don't kill it. But I have cattle too. I'm telling you, it is an ecological disaster. It is almost impossible to eradicate once it gets started on the prairie. Man, I'm not telling you what to do or anything, but if you like to eat beef now and then, it'll be cheaper if you don't spread that serecia around. :help2


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## Haglerfarm (Aug 11, 2008)

Every part of the country is different. It does not compete anything out down here. Actually you are seeing it less and less. I can see your point on the prairie. But, in places it does serve a purpose. Actually a lot of land over here in CRP are planted in serecia for the birds and other wildlife.
I think each person should investigate with their agriculture people to see what works and does not work in your neck of the woods.
What is causing problems here is thistle, I was used to it in Oregon, but now in Tennessee it is getting prevalent. Also in our field is something called sensitive fern. I am seeing all over the county. It is choking out other stuff, serecia included. It first showed up in our bottom ground. But, it is spreading.
Johnsongrass used to be a problem, but not so much now.
Another really big problem in the south is kudzu. You think serecia is a problem, try kudzu. Goats are about the only thing that can kill it. It would make good goat feed, but there is not much way to control it, especially in a wooded environment.
So, each part of the country is different.
Les


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## stoneyheightsfarm (Jan 19, 2008)

Just did a search for sericea... we've got that, too. Goats love it when it's young (will even pass up trees for it), but when it matures, they leave it alone. Read a bit about that--higher tannins when it matures make it unpalatable. Cows will eat it when it's young or mowed, too, according to some site I checked! 

Thistle! Johnsongrass! KUDZU!! Les, such ugly words!  Haven't seen sensitive fern here...


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## SALTCREEK_Nubians_Linda (Nov 13, 2007)

Oh yeah, I've seen Kudzu. The vine that ate the south. I didn't know that goats could kill it. I didn't know anything could.


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## SALTCREEK_Nubians_Linda (Nov 13, 2007)

Is it Les, at Haglerfarm? This is confusing.

Ok, I think I know what white clover you are talking about. It's a sweetclover called Melilotus alba

This it not the same as that short clover that most people see in their yards and think of when they think clover. That clover is toxic when it is wilted. This clover is a whole other thing, and yess, it is good for goats and other ruminants. The common name is White Sweetclover. It is tall and has small spikes of white flowers. It is sort of like alfalfa.


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## Daniel Babcock (May 28, 2008)

Yes, that is it thanks


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## Haglerfarm (Aug 11, 2008)

Yes, it is the tall white clover. I can't remember the name of it. I thought it was something like Landina, ladino or....?
The goats love it. I didn't know the other was toxic when wilted, but the goats never eat it anyway.
Thanks,
Les


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

I will be putting out my rye and deer plot mix again. I was soo happy with the fall and winter and early spring greens everyone got because of it. I just brush hogged and then seeded, it worked wonderful. Vicki


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## SALTCREEK_Nubians_Linda (Nov 13, 2007)

I seed my large garden plot to hard red winter wheat. I take my does in there to graze. It's a good cover crop and great winter forage and survives well through freezing weather, down to a point. (well enough that it's a huge cash crop here for thousands of farmers....the breadbasket of america right here.)

I might overseed the buck pasture as well and add in some vetch which comes out early in the Spring here.


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