# Help cant get milk to taste right



## smithsfarm (Jul 6, 2008)

:help I am at a total loss and could really use some input. I have a yearling milker lamancha. She has really good milk, if you drink it before 24 hrs. After the milk sits for about 24 hrs it tastes really bad, my husband describes it as a barny taste, I think it tastes like it is about to spoil. the milk has no bad smell when it does this unless you heat it up, then it smells terrible right away.
Our vet had us treat her with 2 5cc shots of batryl that did not help so we did a culture, it came back neg.
We had our Buck on the same side of the barn (he is 4 mo old) so we just moved him to the other side of the barn on sat. night, we also changed her hay on sat. night (the hay we had was getting pretty dusty) How long if one of those 2 things are the problem would it take for her milk to clear?
I milk her into a stainless steel seamless stock pot, strain it and put it directly into the freezer for approx 1 1/2 hrs, (she is only milking about a pint a milking). I was her good with an udder wash from tractor supply and then teat dip her with a teat dip from tractor supply. I use disposable dixie cups to teat dip. 
Please help. anyone have any clues what could be going on or how long after a change like we have made to know if it is it or if we need to keep searching.
Thanks in advance for your help


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

How long after the Baytril did you do the milk test? Mostly curiosity.

What udder wash. How about just using baby wetones from wallmart, the ones that pop out of the top so they don't get barn air in them, and then see if that changes the milk. If it doesn't and the prewash isn't the problem than do a fecal or simply worm her.

What grain are you feeding her?
Is she on a good mineral?
How long has she been milking?
Does she get any alfalfa at all?

She is milking dismally, is she also nursing kids? Perhaps the link is between the poor milksupply and the non keeping quality of the milk. Is her udder even?

Also welcome to the forum! Vicki


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## smithsfarm (Jul 6, 2008)

We waited for 8 milkings after the baytril to start tasteing.

she is on a grain mix from a local feed mill. It was developed and used by a local dairy goat farm, not real sure of the mix. 

The hay I just switched her is a grassy hay but it does have alfalfa in it

she is on a purina mill mineral

She is a yearling and has been milking since end of march first of april. and is not nursing kids.

I am using Dairy land udder wash from tractor supply (it is pink) but i do use paper towels that i store in the barn so I will try the baby wipes

Her udder is pretty even 

Thanks for the welcome and the input, we are new to the goat world. I have 4 other doelings and a buck. I bought this yearling milker to learn how to milk before I try kidding and milking all my other doelings. I bought her about 4 weeks ago and havent got the milk to taste right from day one.


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## Rose (Oct 26, 2007)

What are you washing your bucket with?

Are you keeping the milk from each milking separate?


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

I can promise you that you will be soo much happier come next lactation at your own farm. So breed her when you can for her to freshen for you. Milking a pint a milking is awful.

"Our vet had us treat her with 2 5cc shots of batryl that did not help so we did a culture, it came back neg." 

What I meant was after you used the Baytril, how long was it before you sent in the milksample? Or was it taken before he started the drugs? If you test milk with antibiotics in it, it comes back as nothing in it. vicki


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## smithsfarm (Jul 6, 2008)

LOL oops sorry, it was almost 2 full weeks after the baytril before we did the cultur.

Should I dry her up and breed her again?

How much milk should she be giving?

Are you saying the milk could be off just because she is a first timer?

I milk by hand and wash the milking pail with with dawn with bleach. I wash it immediatly after milking.

I do keep each milking seperate, this way i am able to track each change we make and how long it takes for the milk to go bad. The time it takes to go bad stays the same as does the bad taste no matter what change we make. 

I think she kidded in March, is it to soon to breed her s


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

No I would continue milking her. At the least you should be getting a quart a milking if not more. Especially her being a Lamancha.

What I meant is that some goats simply stress when moved, they milk little, and just take awhile to get it all together. But she is young and will rebound quickly. I would breed her the next heat, milk her for 100 days if you can, and then dry her off. I would also do a dry cow infusion if you can, Pirsue or Ken's Quartermaster...perhaps someone purchasing a whole case will have some for sale so you can buy two on the forum? This will clean up any offending bacteria.

Perhaps also try putting a clean piece of butter muslin over your milk pail, keep it on with a large rubberband or tie it, milk into the muslin so the barn air stays out of the milk. Have a frozen waterbottle in the bottom so you are milking onto it and the milk is chilling in the barn. Take it to the house when you are done milking don't wait until chores are done. Plus then you don't have to strain the milk.

Don't shake your milk, in fact dont' apply so much pressure to the teat that you get too much foam.

I think machine milking in this way gives you better milk because you never see foam in your can or inflations.

When you agitate goat milk it actually breaks down the fatty acids and make milk taste bad.

Also check the temp of the fridge. Vicki


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## Guest (Jul 15, 2008)

Fact or Fiction....I really can't tell you, but lots of folks say that keeping Baking Soda out there "free choice" helps with the taste of milk. I couldn't tell that it made any difference here.
Also....if this gal ain't doing but a pint per milking, I would fall back to one milking a day, and let her udder fill up more "if it will". If her production is no more than that, I would follow Vicki's advice on getting this doe headed towards her next freshening.
Be sure she is getting clean fresh water to drink daily.
....and last...I really believe that my feeding of ample amounts of high calcium foods like alfalfa and beet pulp helps with the taste of my goats milk here.

Hope you get it figured out before next season........and now with one in milk would be a good time to play with it some.


Whim


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## Sondra (Oct 25, 2007)

Hi and Welcome to the group. I think Vicki is right cool and filter your milk immediately and get a thermometer and ck your frig. keep the milk in the coldest part of your frig. Keep on milking her and rather than once a day try milking her 3 times a day for a week then go back to two times a day but also add alfalfa to her diet. I think you'll see a difference I also use beet pulp but know that Vicki doesn't and her milk is wonderful too. 
I think I would also retest the milk to make sure she doesn't have mastitis going on.


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## Guest (Jul 15, 2008)

I'm gonna make a comment (for discusions sake) just to see what yaw's thinking is.

I try to feed these high calcium foods to try to max out the calcium contents in my milk. As best that I understand...acids in milk can create OFF taste also. Since calcium absorbs lots of acids......my theory is that if the milk is max out with calcium, that it will help better control some of those acids that may cause OFF tasting milk.
Whatcha think about this theory of mine.....or is it just hokus pokus.

Whim


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## paulaswrld (Mar 2, 2008)

Wow, learning new thins everyday! I never knew about the foam part. Am I to understand that when I have a lot of foam it is because I may be applying to much pressure to the teat? I always have foam...crud...and here I thought I had this!?

Paula


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## baileybunch (Oct 26, 2007)

Here's what I learned from the vet who tested our samples at Columbia Univ. High protein feeds make urea which gets passed through in urine but if the protien is higher than the goat can assimilate it <can> effect the milk. Just something I had to consider here...


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## hamilton40 (Jun 21, 2008)

Me too on the foam. I usualy have at least 2" of foam. I always thought it was a good thing so I could grab that one hair that always seams to drop in.
Clay


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## Guest (Jul 15, 2008)

Foam......uh, when I hand milk...I kinda let the milk hit a glancing angle into the side of the bucket ( just above the milk level )....not down into the milk.....I think that this helps keep some foaming down. Try it and see if this helps for you also.

Whim


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## Sondra (Oct 25, 2007)

yep me too Whim I always milked to the side of the bucket so as not to get the foam. Waste of my time waiting for it to settle so I can cap bottles.

As for the acid question Whim I haven't a clue. All I know is that my girls get all the alfalfa pellets I can afford and if I run out of anything it will be grain not alfalfa. I have excellent tasting milk that lasts 7 to 10 days and usually 10. I chill in the bucket with ice bottles and then strain and bottle into frig or freezer. Cooling down to 40 degrees within 30 min is my goal.


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## kidsngarden (Oct 28, 2007)

I am having this same problem - I had posted about it in the cheese forum. I didn't know about the foam thing. Maddie has TONS of foam! I'm convinced Capella is just a loss. Her udder is just totally messed up. I just either freeze her milk right away fro soaping or give it directly to the chickens. She will be culled next freshening.

Too much pressure, gosh, Maddies teats are so big I don't know how to milk with less pressure! I will try it today.

I am on this mission to get my milk to taste decent for more than 24 hours so I can make ungoaty cheese...it's making me crazy. I still suspect it's something they are eating in the woods, but I'm determined to try everything I can to get it tasting better!

So the milk stone on the buckets can cause a goaty taste? what about the jars you store it in? Should you clean those like you clean the buckets? I was told to clean my milk buckets with detergent then a bleach solution and let it air dry. That will get the milk stone off?


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## Rose (Oct 26, 2007)

I switched from regular detergent to the acid wash from Hoegger.

http://www.hoeggergoatsupply.com/xcart/product.php?productid=3838&cat=15&page=1

Yes, I use it for the jars, too.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

We don't get milkstone here, so can't help you with that. Milkstone is pourous so of course it can trap bacteria you can't see. So yes it could affect your milk.

I know alot of folks who feed alfalfa hay, and do not feed it right before milking to keep the milk better tasteing. I am kind of doubtful that anythng eaten right before milking has anything to do with the milk already in the udder.

I have never had a customer tell me my milk tasted bad, in fact I have several who come to me after trying others milk, or who switch and then come back to me even though I am further away.

Another thought is to wear gloves, maybe it's you?

I do keep going back to this 1 pint a milking, I simply don't know how a Lamancha could milk only that much and have a healthy udder. We had less than top pedigreed LaManchas in the dairy and the one thing you can say about them is that even they had better than utility udders, they were the backbone of our milkers, certainly outmilking all of our purebred Lamancha's and Nubians.

With LSU still running free milk tests I would also send in another milk sample and ask specifically for it to be tested for subclincial staph. Info in goatkeeping 101. Vicki


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## kidsngarden (Oct 28, 2007)

I'm curious as to what causes milk stone that you don't get it there, Vicki? I'm off to look up the free testing for my girls!

Thanks!


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## Ashley (Oct 25, 2007)

When I have the bucket in ice, I don't have any foam by the time I strain it.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Likely hard water? I have no idea  We have a filter at our well. vicki


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## kidsngarden (Oct 28, 2007)

I have thought about putting a frozen water bottle IN the milk bucket, but then worried about cleanliness issues which would also make my milk have an off taste.

My ulimate plan was to milk directly into a large filter strainer (the big one on Hoeggers) over a bucket that's inside another one that has frozen water bottles in it - what a piece of work that would be!

I have been contemplating a cow lately...do you have the same problems with cows milk??? I know I would still have to have goats, but man, this fragile protein thing is killing me!


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## kidsngarden (Oct 28, 2007)

Vicki McGaugh Tx Nubians said:


> Likely hard water? I have no idea  We have a filter at our well. vicki


I do have very hard water, but how do you know you have milk stone in the first place? What does it look like?


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## smithsfarm (Jul 6, 2008)

ok I just contacted LSU and I am going to ship a sample on monday. my question is what is the best thing to use to keep the milk cold during shipping. I'm going to over night it but do not know what to pack it in to keep it cold. also what do i use to put the sample in? what all will they test for?
I was thinking about going down to the one time a day milking to try to get her udder to grow a bit, how long should i do that for before going back to the 2 times a day and should I wait till I have the test results before doing this? Will going down to 1 time a day start the drying off process?
sorry about all the questions but I am finding out there is a whole lot I am very ignorant on where goats are concerned LOL


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Just keep milking her twice a day and be happy with her. We simply don't know enough about her back ground to know why she is milking so poorly. Going down to milking once a day will dry her up. To increase production you milk more often, this also gives her another meal for more calories. Is she lean or fat?

I get little styrofoam coolers from my vet. Jeffers and places that sell vaccines ship their vaccines in them. I then put the milk samples into little jars, the tiny baby food jars are great for this or you can get specimin containers from your vet. Then put in as many ice packs as you can, your vet should have them also.

You really have to one night it, which of course costs, with this heat. Vicki


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## smithsfarm (Jul 6, 2008)

Here is a pic of birdie in the am prior to milking this is as big as she gets and a pic of her she weighs about 115-120ibs











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## smithsfarm (Jul 6, 2008)

*Re: Help cant get milk to taste right Update*

:biggrin I am so excited that I have to share! I finally got my milk to last longer than 24 hrs. I just tasted some that is 48 hrs old and omg I couldnt believe it, it tasted very good!!!! No foul taste not even a hint that it is about to go bad. 
I started using a glass container, puting the frozen water bottle in it, putting a filter over the top and milking over the filter (which also cut way down on the foam) and it appears to be working. I also moved the buck to the other side of the barn last weekend and changed her hay last weekend. I am not sure which one made the difference so Im not going to change any of them. I am so excited I think I finally got it. I will update in another day or two to let you all know if the milk continues to hold
Thank you everyone for all your help, I couldnt have got it right without all your help.
Oh yeah still gonna send a sample to LSU just for safety reasons.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Wonderful! Vicki


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## Guest (Jul 18, 2008)

Ah Ha !.......at least you know now that some of the problem had to do with your handling technique. That's always a good starting point. Glad you tried some of this tips before giving up on the doe.
The more you mess with it, the more tricks of the trade that you will learn in time.

Best wishes, Whim


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## kidsngarden (Oct 28, 2007)

(insert green with envy smiley here) Congrats!

Mine is still yucky. I'll be sending in samples on Monday too. And buying cows milk today :mad

Grrrr.


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## smithsfarm (Jul 6, 2008)

well I may have gotten excited a little to early, Tuesdays milk did turn this morning and when I heat the milk (even the fresh milk) it smells terrible. Although it is lasting slightly longer I still have a ways to go, so a sample will be off to LSU for sure on Monday
Hang in there Whim, we will get it figured out.


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## smithsfarm (Jul 6, 2008)

*Re: Help cant get milk to taste right Update we got it*

OMG after months of trying we finally got it!!!! We have changed the way we milk, the way we handle, the housing of the bucks, the hay she was eating. We had lab work that all came back neg. changed what we milked into, everything but stand on my head to get her milk to last longer than 24 hrs. I was about to give up thinking she just plain had bad milk. Some one asked me if I had hard water and if my feed had molassis in it, well I do have hard water and my feed did have molassis in it. They suggested changing her grain so that it contained no molassis. Out of desperation I did it and much to my surprise her coat started looking better, her udder was much softer and not as tight and her milk is WONDERFUL and is not turning bad!!!!! 
Whim If you are still struggling and you have hard water try changing the grain it has worked wonders for me.
I cant thank everyone enough for all the suggestions and support I am so glad I didnt give up on her.


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## Guest (Jul 28, 2008)

:biggrin I think you must be thinking of Bethany....not Whim. I've not had any problems here. 
Last time I drank any goaty milk was about 40 years ago when my Dad would buy those $20 sale barn brush goats (the ones with big enough udders). Back then, there were very few real dairy goats in our area.....so if you could find anything that had a little togg or alpine in it, you was kinda lucky.

One other thing is to run your fridge about as cold as you can without everything in there freezing......there is a huge difference on how long milk will last when kept at 36 to 38 ,instead of 42 to 45.


Glad you getting things worked out.

Whim


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## Guest (Jul 28, 2008)

I have milk that lasts 10 days also, and foam and I have very sweet milk here.. I feed alfalfa pellets, grass hay (which is very weedy) and they love it, and my own grain mix with no molasses( when I stopped using molasses products my milk got better) which consist of barley, oats, sunflower seeds, and very little corn.. free choice minerals (sweetlix or black onyx) and free choice baking soda.. I do milk to the side of the pan to cut down on foam and take my milk in immediately to strain and cool.. I never have goaty tasting milk or cheese.. 
One thing I really do think matters is fresh, clean water and they get that three times a day with buckets scrubbed out twice a day.. I have noticed that right after buckets are scubbed, they drink and drink and drink.. 
I currently have a doe that I have been milking for two years now(without freshening) she has absolutely the best milk ever, her nick name is milking mama and I reserve her milk for drinking.. I love that doe, but she is 7 years old now.
Barbara


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## kidsngarden (Oct 28, 2007)

OK, so you think that hard water can cause bad taste...I still haven't gotten my samples out to LSU...I really need to just start there.


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## smithsfarm (Jul 6, 2008)

kindsngarden I would most definitely try changing your grain. It has worked for me and like I said I tried everything but stand on my head while milking :rofl to get her milk right. I noticed a difference within 2 milkings after changing the grain. I am positive it was the hard water/molasses mix.


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## kidsngarden (Oct 28, 2007)

They are already on dry cob. I try to only water them with rain water until it gets yucky or I run out, then it's my very Iron laden well water.

I think milk stone on my buckets could be a culprit too.


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