# Jeffers order



## cariboujaguar (Feb 9, 2009)

I'm about to restock my fridge/med cabinet with all my supplies for the year, help me refine my list or add to it...

*Purchase List*
Banamine (vet?)
BOSE (vet)
Cydectin
Dectomax® Injectable For Cattle & Swine 
Disposable Syringe w/Needle Combo (*what sizes*?)
CD/T (Sooo many brands/types, *which one to get*?) 
Corid® Amprolium 9.6% Solution
copper bolus' (I can't find these on Jeffers...)
Something aresole to spray navels and disbudded heads with 
Quick Bayt for flies
Bloat guard or Bloat release
Pill gun for bolusing

*Already in my cabinet:*
Probios
Vet RX
Red Cell
Nutridrench
Vit B Complex
MSM
Ivermectin
Dectomax
Safeuard
Deccox
Albon pills
Sulumet
Selenium gel
Calcium/selenium gel
CMPK gel
Activated Charcol gel
Shear Majic hoof shears
Goat Weigh Tape
Lambar nipples
Coopertox to use on your does feet after trimming, put it into a spray bottle,

*CD/T treatments:* (which one do you use?)
Caliber™ 7 
Vision CDT 
Bar-Vac CD/T 
Cavalry™ 9
Essential 3 + T (CD&T) 
Covexin 8 
Clostridium Perfringes Types C & D Antitoxins (this one isn't tetnus right?)
Tetanus Toxoid Concentrate (and this one is just tetnus right?)

*Pneumonia, foot rot and shipping fever:* (which one do you use?)
Gallimycin 100 mg
Tylan Injectable
Agrimycin 100
Di-Methox (Injection, powder or liquid?)
Bio-Mycin® 200

*Penicillin's* (which one do you use?)
Long-Lasting Penicillin
Pro-Pen G™ Injection
Water Soluble Penicillin G Potassium, USP

*A few questions...*

Di-Methox Injection 40% it says 'compare to albon' Now I was given Albon pills by the vet for a doe with Cocci (she ended up dying and I still have the pills) what is Albon for? should I buy this?

I am still weary of Corrid I have been told horror stories about it's use yet all my vets have suggested using it. Is there some kind of program I need to follow to ensure the goats don't get polio from it, or are those stories jut plain not true?

Also I have 2 coccidistats I can buy in my grain, Deccox and Rumensin... which one do you suggest I buy?

And can you feed calf grain to goats? I found a 22% with rumensin in it and am tempted to try it as all the grains here are only 14% at most 

Thanks so much guys! I'm still learning and re-learning. Thanks for bearing with me!


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Purchase List
Banamine (vet?)
BOSE (vet)
Lute (vet) Little reason to have a whole bottle of this
Dairy Nutri-Drench™ (was told this is the same as goat but cheaper...)fluff
Cydectin
Dectomax® Injectable For Cattle & Swine does ivermectin work for you in your area
Disposable Syringe w/Needle Combo (what sizes?)3cc with needle and then a box of 6cc's with needles, a few 12 and 2 ouncers for oral meds
CD/T (Sooo many brands/types, which one to get?) I use barvac C&T
1 packet Vitamins & Electrolytes "PLUS" fluff
Corid® Amprolium 9.6% Solutionjeffers carries the pints now
copper colus' (I can't find these on Jeffers...)in the calf section

Already in my cabinet:
Probios
Vet RXfluff
Red Cellfluff
Nutridrenchfluff
Vit B Complexalways buy fortefied B and get thiamin from your vet
MSM
Ivermectindoes it work?
Dectomaxsame as ivermectin
Safeuard valbazen is the much better choice as tape worm control in kids
Deccox  (the 40% or the Deccox M for milk feeding?
Albon pills if the sustained relief oblets, give them to someone with sheep
Sulumet the dosages on this are soo high it's impossible to actually get this down a kid except through tubing, I don't know anyone who uses this succesffully who also fecals and knows it works
Selenium gel there is no eveidence anywhere that this is more than fluff
Calcium/selenium gel oral calcium is very hard on the throat of the goat, dilute this with gatoraide and give, if you have a good feeding program you won't ever use this
CMPK gelsee Calciu/selenium gel above
Activated Charcol put this in the blender and turn it into a powder right now before you need it, then you can just add it to oil and tube

CD/T treatments: (which one do you use?)
Caliber™ 7 
Vision CDT 
Bar-Vac CD/T this is what I use 
Cavalry™ 9
Essential 3 + T (CD&T) 
Covexin 8 
Clostridium Perfringes Types C & D Antitoxins (this one isn't tetnus right?)
Tetanus Toxoid Concentrate (and this one is just tetnus right?)

Pneumonia, foot rot and shipping fever: (which one do you use?)
Gallimycin 100 mg
Tylan InjectableI keep the 50 around for kids
Agrimycin 100
Di-Methox (Injection, powder or liquid?)
Bio-Mycin® 200 this is what I keep on hand but goats don't get cattle foot rot, they do get soft feet due to wet soils, but with enough copper most feet problems, other than needing to be trimmed goes away with just copper

Penicillin's (which one do you use?)
Long-Lasting Penicillin
Pro-Pen G™ Injection
Water Soluble Penicillin G Potassium, USP I buy this one

A few questions...

Di-Methox Injection 40% it says 'compare to albon' Now I was given Albon pills by the vet for a doe with Cocci (she ended up dying and I still have the pills) what is Albon for? should I buy this?

Albon, Dimethox, sulfaquinoxline, sulfamethazine are all sulfa's all have different percentages of meds in them if liquid and different mg/kg used dependant upon what sulfa it is...you have to follow advice from someone who uses the drug succesffully and knows it works by fecal sampling...like the info in goatkeeping 101.

I am still weary of Corrid I have been told horror stories about it's use yet all my vets have suggested using it. Is there some kind of program I need to follow to ensure the goats don't get polio from it, or are those stories jut plain not true?why would we have so much info on the successfuly use of corid working if it was going to harm our goats or not work?

Also I have 2 coccidistats I can buy in my grain, Deccox and Rumensin... which one do you suggest I buy? Rarely is any grain dosed with enough drugs to actually work for anything but prevention. I am moving to rumensin this year after years on deccox and years before then on bovatec (lasalocid) I am using corid for prevention and then the rumensin which is a local feed here dosed for goats. Actualy it's a feed mix that orginated at Langston University, Oklahoma.

And can you feed calf grain to goats? I found a 22% with rumensin in it and am tempted to try it as all the grains here are only 14% at most. Once again how much of the calf grain does a kid have to eat to keep their bloodlevels of cocci meds up to treat cocci?

Thanks so much guys! I'm still learning and re-learning. Thanks for baring with me!


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## Guest (Mar 26, 2009)

Grrr.....I had this nicee long response and Vicki beats me to it. Sigh

So here :yeahthat :rofl


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Shear Majic hoof shears
Goat Weigh Tape
Lambar nipples
Something aresole to spray navels and disbudded heads with (as the holder and disbudder of goats and me the sprayer I am not spraying aluminium fumes into my husbands face, not a fan of the alushield. And think of all the years I sprayed a carcinooen, Fural into his face! hmmmm

Quick Bayt for flies
Coopertox to use on your does feet after trimming, put it into a spray bottle, until your new copper information toughens the hooves up.
Bloat guard or Bloat release
Pill gun for bolusing

Vicki


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## Guest (Mar 26, 2009)

Shears if you are going to shave them and different blades.


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## cariboujaguar (Feb 9, 2009)

Vicki McGaugh Tx Nubians said:


> *Purchase List*
> Banamine (vet?)
> BOSE (vet)
> ephederine (vet)
> ...


updated list... Thanks SOOOOO much guys!!!!


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## megan (Nov 10, 2008)

I have always used the vision CD&T 
I know it costs more but it says it is anti sting and I have never used anything else to compare it with.

Are you going to vaccinate for pneumonia? sorry if that is already in your list. I looked but there is a lot of stuff there!!


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## cariboujaguar (Feb 9, 2009)

I never noticed them act like the CD/T stung... but it wasn't the vision kind- hmmmm


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## cindy (Sep 16, 2008)

:wow This list is fantastic!!! I have learned a lot by trial and error. I wish I had a list like this YEARS ago!! Thank you!! Cindy


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## KingsCoGoatGuy (Dec 20, 2008)

Vicki, Have you heard of Newcells??? Is if fuff or what?


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## foggybottom (Mar 7, 2009)

Maybe I missed it on the list, but epinephrine is one of my must haves. I have only needed it once in 9 years, but had it and sure glad I did!


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## cariboujaguar (Feb 9, 2009)

foggybottom: what is epinephrine? whats it for? 

Cindy: I am also sooo pleased w/ the response I got! Everyone is so helpful, so many were willing to add and subtract from my list. I will probably be spending a few hundred more then I had planned, but it will spent on things I need so it's worth it!


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## shawhee (Jun 28, 2008)

epinephrine is used for anaphalictic shock. Some meds/vaccines can cause this, and if you dont have it ready - right now (not a run in the house and get it) then you can loose the goat right there. I have not expericenced this, but sure do have epi on hand.


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## megan (Nov 10, 2008)

And as a bonus epi is not very expensive so even if you never have to use it you will not be out very much. sure beats losing a goat. make sure to have it ready to go whenever you are vaccinating.



> I will probably be spending a few hundred more then I had planned


Yep!! it adds up fast and you always end up finding more stuff that you need and those things that you really want.
I always dread seeing the grand total of my goat shopping sprees!! :biggrin


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## foggybottom (Mar 7, 2009)

You do have to get it from a vet, but yes it's very inexpensive ($5 maybe), so cheap insurance.
The goat I gave an injection to, immediately started to slobber and stagger and go down, luckily I had it with me, she was fine in a couple minutes.


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## cariboujaguar (Feb 9, 2009)

yikes! okay, adding that to the list for sure!!! thanks!


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Sorry Alex just never heard of it. Just know that most things that are oral preperations for adult ruminants don't work. Vicki


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## cariboujaguar (Feb 9, 2009)

thanks for the heads up Vicki... maybe that's something to reasearch and see if it works for goats or not... maybe Foggybottom could open a thread about it and see if anyone else has success with it? IMO if it's only $5 what can it hurt to have on hand? seems like a good backup plan...

Oh and Vicki a few Q's... 

you said Dectomax is the same as Ivermectin? So if Ivermectin doesn't work I obviously shouldn't expect dectomax to work? Because I was having No success at all with Ivermectin so was adviced to buy Dectomax and it seemed to work... everyone put weight back on... so I'm not sure if I comprehended your notes proparly or not... 

I have heard about this 'ivermectin plus' is it the same as normal ivermectin? should I have any faith it will work better then the normal kind?

Is safeguard and Pancur the same product? I was told Pancur works better all feed store peeps and vets say it's the same item...

I was told that levivmasole is terribly dangerous as well... but I used it before and it worked great... 

Does the water soluble pen replace the need for injectable?

A 'balling gun' is what I need for bolus' right?

I still can NOT find the copper bolus'. I searched for copper, bolus and looked all over the cattle section... link please?

Is their a diff between fortified b complex and vitamin b complex Plus? the latter is more expensive, but the fortified is what you suggested I get? So is the 'plus better' or just a sales technique? They are both on back order, is there something else I can get or another catalog I could order from? 

(I'm adding Q's as I make my order)


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## red farmer (Feb 5, 2009)

AT jeffers in the search box type in 

Copasure is the name i=of the copper bolus's

also item number MG-c1
MG-c2 is the item numbers.


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## cariboujaguar (Feb 9, 2009)

Thankyou!!!


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## red farmer (Feb 5, 2009)

don't forget the scale Weighing in Grams.
need to look at e-bay for that. It sure does help alot with the measurements.

ANd the Bolus gun there are different sizes out there. I bought a big one forst of all. Made life hard,Found one to fit my Gelatin capsules and Easy as pie now.


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## cariboujaguar (Feb 9, 2009)

I got a balling gun for calves... will that be the right size? 

what is the diff between a Luer Lock and Luer slip syringe and what is the ML-CC ratio? isn't it about even?

maybe someday someone with more experience (and most likely no time) can copy and paste their jeffers order here for us all LOL


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## KingsCoGoatGuy (Dec 20, 2008)

Vicki, I found this information: http://www.drugs.com/vet/newcells-can.html


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## megan (Nov 10, 2008)

Luer lock syringes - the needle twists on - - these are more secure. as long as you have the needle twisted tight it should not accidentally slip off. 

luer slip syringes - the needle just slips on and off. the needle can accidentally come off easier when you don't want it to.

I get the luer lock for giving shots and I also get some luer slips syringes without needles. it is nice to have a few around because the tip of them actually sticks out a little so the needle can slip over. this makes it handy if you need to use one to oral dose a single goat. my opinion anyways!
jeffers really has the best prices on syringe/needle combos.

cc and ml are the same.

I use the small calf gun.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

thanks for the heads up Vicki... maybe that's something to reasearch and see if it works for goats or not... maybe Foggybottom could open a thread about it and see if anyone else has success with it? IMO if it's only $5 what can it hurt to have on hand? seems like a good backup plan...
........................

I was talking to Alex about the newcell, not epi, of course you want to keep epi pulled and ready to give...does you no good to have it in the house in the fridge if you are giving shots in the barn. I keep 3cc pulled and in a tampon container.



you said Dectomax is the same as Ivermectin? So if Ivermectin doesn't work I obviously shouldn't expect dectomax to work? Because I was having No success at all with Ivermectin so was adviced to buy Dectomax and it seemed to work... everyone put weight back on... so I'm not sure if I comprehended your notes proparly or not...
........................................

If you don't learn to fecal you have no idea if Ivermectin worked, if Decotomax didn't or if the problems were even worms that made your goats thin. It's a whole lot of expensive guesing, and most of the expense is at the health of your goats livers as they process all these drugs you guess with. Seemed to work at some point isn't enough.

I have heard about this 'ivermectin plus' is it the same as normal ivermectin? should I have any faith it will work better then the normal kind?
.........................

The plus in the Ivermectin is for liverflukes, if you don't have liverflukes there is no reason to use Ivermectin Plus. Ivermectin although not a good wormer for us in the south with all worm burdens being liverflukes and HC (haemoncus contortus/barber pole worm) it will kill the arrested lifecycle during the winter and is a good cool weather worm..wormer. So know what parasties you are dealing with by fecaling, identify the eggs and kill the suckers during their winter hybernation in your goats, because during spring, summer and fall, you are just evacuating them out of the goat. At some point you might want to stop listening to those who are telling you just horrible information like that Ivermectin Plus and plain Ivermectin 1% is the same thing.

Is safeguard and Pancur the same product? I was told Pancur works better all feed store peeps and vets say it's the same item...
....................

Yes Safeguard and Panacur are exactly the same drug...fendbendazole. make a note of where you learned that Panacur could work better than safeguard...being exactly the same..don't listen to them.

I was told that levivmasole is terribly dangerous as well... but I used it before and it worked great...
......................

If overdosed you may see your goats exhibit some neuro symptoms like salivating...is that dangerous, no. For some folks who don't fecal and overuse Cydectin and can't move back to Ivermectin, this is one of their last chances with a drug, it is wonderful both on it's own but as a cocktail with other wormers.

Does the water soluble pen replace the need for injectable?
....................

You inject the water soluable pennicillins just like all penns.

A 'balling gun' is what I need for bolus' right?
.............................
My capsules fit in a pill gun, just this long plastic tube pills fit in, much easier to use something that fits what you are doing rather than something too large. I hold my capsule in place with a little peanut butter.


Is their a diff between fortified b complex and vitamin b complex Plus? the latter is more expensive, but the fortified is what you suggested I get? So is the 'plus better' or just a sales technique? They are both on back order, is there something else I can get or another catalog I could order from?
....................................

I have no idea, I keep the fortified B complex and thiamin from my vet. I order from jeffers mostly, but do order at least once a year from QCsupply.com so if they are out of it, someone will have it...valley vet...caprinesupply.com....hoeggers etc. I believe Kaye has a post in goatkeeping 101 on the mg/kg of which b vitmains you have to use.
....................................

And this post....not even knowing the cc and ml's are exactly the same thing, the ivermectin, safeguard etc.... is my point to you. You need to learn the very basics, follow exactly what someone else is doing and then branch off on your own when you get your sea legs. It is a whole lot of difference between what we do with Purebred Nubians and others do with their goats...you have some excellent herds in your area on this forum... Tammy (4fromgoatilla) Sandy Rhiley (Rhuel's nubians) you certainly don't have to fly by the seat of your pants with this. Who ever has been mentoring you has not been doing their job for you to not know this basic stuff. I was you when I started out to, I was given the worst of information...I had to go it alone, and I did make alot of enemies in my local area, because I was very vocal that there information was wrong, to other new people. I had testing to prove what I knew. Most have come around, bo-se and copper info is common knowledge now, dietary alfalfa in some form everyday.... I hope you take this in the spirit in which I am telling you this. An remember there are those who do not have your herds best interests at heart, especially when you have really nice stock that may threaten them. vicki


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## cariboujaguar (Feb 9, 2009)

Oh trust me I am taking everything you say to heart. I have been trying to find logic in and understand the advice I was given, my 'mentors' had no proof, no percentages or facts, just their word and theories/experiences... I felt I had no choice but to go by their advice as I couldn't find better resources. But it takes awhile for problems to arise in your goats and you to realize 'hey, everything they tell me to do is killing my goats... hey, this seems like WAY too much to be giving them and not at all natural things to give to ruminant animal' (IE coffee, whisky/liquor etc.) I began to cross reference things, realize all the vets and local beeders suggest the opposite of some of their treatments and their results were not consistent even in their own herds... a light came on: 'this just isn't right, these articles, PUBLISHED knowledgable people, vets and big breeders are contradicing these guys...' I delved deeper as my herd developed and I talked with more people and when I was no loger their 'loyal subject' attitudes turned sour and I decided to leave. At which point I was blessed by finding this place where questions arn't angrily met and challenging is welcomed and FACTS and SCIENCE are the base of your advice. Oh and you guys have actually said 'I don't know' about things and not just pretended you did know... So trust me, I take your advice for what it is: VERY highly welcomed help! I have lost ALOT of goats, ALOT of money following the wrong paths. I am bound and determined to be more logical, less trusting, more cynical and scientific about things. I will fill my medical kit with things I NEED and things that WORK and will use treatments backed by fecals and facts. I can't thank you guys enough and will never ever have a problem with your advice to me, no matter how stern or confusing LOL, it is welcomed!


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## red farmer (Feb 5, 2009)

I bought a baling gun for calves but the capsuls were too small and i had trouble with the capsuls and the fight was HARD! So then at the local co-op i found 4 different sizes of Baling guns and i had my gelatin capsule with me. so i could get the right ohh tne. and now with the right one the capsul does not fall out. it has to be pushed out. and is so much easier with the right size gun. because you are already fighting the goat don't fight the baling gun.


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