# Do you recognize these guys? (helminth egg pictures)



## happy vagabonds (Jun 24, 2012)

Well... I did my first real fecal exam today. Three times...










I believe that 'J' is a coccidia oocyst?

'D' looks different than the rest... and so does 'C', maybe? I know that the black round thing is an air bubble.

The rest look like some kind of strongyle eggs? They are very small. I did recognize a singular HC egg in my first exam, but found none in this third exam. I used a fresh sample for this third exam. These eggs are probably more than half the size of what I believe is an HC egg.

I counted at least 39 of these... multiplied by 50 is 1950/epg.

I wormed her on 2/24 with Ivomec+ and on 4/8 with Safeguard. She was also copper bolus'd on 4/26. I did testing last year with Safeguard and found that it was effective (then). She has had string of pearl poops for over a month now. It went away shortly after she kidded, which led me to believe that it was hormonal, but returned about a week after she kidded. Now her poops are pretty clumpy, but still pelleted.

I am thinking to give her another dose of Safeguard or maybe try Valbazen? Cydectin requires too long of milk withdrawal, yes?


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## hsmomof4 (Oct 31, 2008)

I do a 3 day milk withdrawal for Cydectin. No biggie. That's what I would do. The others will probably not touch those worms.


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## happy vagabonds (Jun 24, 2012)

I thought Cydectin was 56 days? 

And any idea of what those eggs are?


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## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

To me, they look like damaged cocci oocytes.


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## happy vagabonds (Jun 24, 2012)

Cindy... really?! *stares* I can see that... hmmm.... 

I wish I could have seen them at higher magnification. When I was doing the test, I was using 10x ocular and 10x magnification as recommended. When I put the camera in the scope, it's a bit higher magnification, tho I haven't figured out exactly what that is yet. Basically, it takes three passes to look at one singular counting chamber when the microscope camera is in place. When I would move to the higher magnification, basically all I could see was white... nothing would come into focus. 

Well shoot... there were a lot of them... Would this be causing the clumpy poops? Her poops are not runny... just string of pearls and now kind of clumpy. I thought cocci should not be an issue for a mature doe... 

I only found 1 HC egg... maybe 2 that looked like moneizia eggs... nothing else jumped out at me... except some long, inanimate spirally looking things that were rather interesting, but I didn't recognize them as worm eggs, so didn't investigate further.


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## happy vagabonds (Jun 24, 2012)

Okay... so I did Doughnut's fecal exam today and only found 3 eggs. I did 2 separate exams from the same sample. I filled the chamber, let it sit for 5 minutes, then turned on the light and began to scan the chambers. When I finished both grids, I scanned the chambers again. Then I rinsed my slide, cleaned it, dried it, then gently stirred the fecal slurry and refilled the chambers and repeated the above procedure.

I did see some of the same small coccidia-type oocytes that are in Dolly's samples, but not nearly the number. And Doughnut's poops are perfectly healthy, so not really surprised by these findings.

For size reference, the aspect ratio of these pictures is the same as the pictures from Dolly's samples, so you see the difference in size between the eggs and the coccidia (?) in Dolly's sample.

So based on all of this... what am I looking at in Dolly's samples? I only saw 1 egg in Dolly's samples and tested her 3 times total.

I totally see how those could be damaged coccidia... probably from being pushed through the strainer when preparing the fecal slurry, yes?

So what should I do to treat her? Same as what I would do for kids? Or... ???


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## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

A is pollen.
B and C are HC

It does not work to stir the sample.
You should only sample from the top and never wait more than 15 mins after first mixing.
5 mins is about optimal.

Lee


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## happy vagabonds (Jun 24, 2012)

A is pollen!!!!!!! hah! Thank you!  So cool!


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## happy vagabonds (Jun 24, 2012)

I'll do another test tomorrow on these girls and see if I get a different result by where I draw the sample from. 

If I find again that I am not showing a lot of HC eggs in Dolly's sample... should I treat her with Albon for coccidia?

I have done 3 tests on Dolly's stool and only found 1 HC egg... total. Mostly seeing those coccidia oocysts... 

Coccidia just doesn't seem to *go* with her poop situation. I would expect coccidia poops to be runny. Not strung together and clumpy. But hey... I am still learning.


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## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

It is unnecessary and inadvisable to deworm for so few eggs since it is for sure an egg laying time of year you obviously have low numbers of adults.
If the cocci eggs are damaged it means her natural immunity is taking care of it and so no.... I would not use anything for coccidia.
Strung together in pearls and dark colored is dehydration. Try to entice her to drink more. She may not like the flavor of the water or what it is offered in.
Lee


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## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

It would help to know what she is eating.
Perhaps there is a mucous forming plant in her diet which also can cause fecal alterations.
Does she range to browse?


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## fmg (Jul 4, 2011)

buckrun said:


> Strung together in pearls and dark colored is dehydration. Try to entice her to drink more. She may not like the flavor of the water or what it is offered in.
> Lee


Huh. I have one doe that I almost always see poo strings on her bum at milking time. She must be picky about her water. I know she likes lemonade, maybe I should offer it to her every milking.


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## happy vagabonds (Jun 24, 2012)

Hmmmm... the poop is dark....

Generally she's getting 50/50 oats and barley... 1lb per milking time. Plus 1 tsp kelp, 1 Tbsp flax seed and 1 oz yeast added to her grain ration. She gets all the 3rd cutting alfalfa hay she can eat. She is now milking 7+ lbs a day (mini-alpine).

We go for foraging walks for an hour or two daily, depending on weather. Generally, they are foraging on things like wild rose, virginia creeper, plantain, honeysuckle, some clover... the lespedeza is starting to come up... mimosa... curly dock... chickweed... henbit... dead nettle... vetch... apple bark... pine... cedar... there is one other plant that they enjoy that I have not yet identified. I need to get on that... And of course various grasses... 

I have noticed an increase in water intake in the past week or so... it's starting to warm up and I am having to fill their water buckets 2x a day now. Not noticing a difference in the clumping with the increased water intake though... 

Thanks for your input, Lee... hoping you can help me figure this out. I will do another fecal tomorrow and be more careful about how I draw up the fecal slurry.


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## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

buckrun said:


> Strung together in pearls and dark colored is dehydration.
> Lee


Thanks, I didn't know that.


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## happy vagabonds (Jun 24, 2012)

Welp... I just conducted my 4th exam on Dolly's poops in as many days and I believe that I have the procedure right and technique down. I followed your advice, Lee, and I am just not finding a good number of HC eggs. I mashed the fecal matter through the strainer and let it sit for 5 minutes to let the eggs rise to the top, then took my sample from the top. Focusing on the grid and on the air bubbles. I scanned both grids, then scanned them again for good measure. 

I found 2 eggs on Dolly's exam today and none on Doughnut's exam. This makes sense to me since they have been wormed twice in recent months and have been copper bolus'd and are now foraging a bit on lespedeza which is known to help reduce gut parasites. So this has me flummoxed with Dolly's poop being what it is. Doughnut eats the same things Dolly does, except Doughnut also gets Rice Bran pellets in her rations. Doughnut's poops are very healthy looking. 

I guess I will have to adopt a wait and watch kind of attitude on this, as she has always been very healthy and I am just waiting for her to resolve this on her own. I am just concerned that this is causing some kind of internal damage (ie: scar tissue?) with this going on for over a month now.


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## grandmajo (May 22, 2008)

What you're seeing in the first group of pics that you posted - in A,B,C,E,F,G,I - are threadworms in their various stages of development in the egg. Generally not a problem in goats unless they occur in large numbers. Based on the research that I've done on these if you have a dozen or more eggs in the fecal exam be assured you have a very heavy infestation because you generally don't see the eggs in a fecal. 

I had a doe that had them here and the only thing that worked to get rid of them was Safeguard. I can't remember if it's ivermectin or cydectin that says it treats threadworms, but for me it didn't work.


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