# For those running a business....discussion....



## Terri-Lynn (Nov 7, 2007)

If you sell at Farmer's Markets what other farm products do you find to be a good mix with your soap business and make use of your existing farm infrastructures?
I've been selling soap for a few years and when I got back into goats pretty well moved everything to gm soaps. This gave me a "primary producer" status. So now I have a full-time booth at a fairly busy year round market and have been steadily picking up wholesale accounts as well... all good. One issue I have with markets is that the busiest ones (here anyway) and all craft shows are all on Saturdays. I am one person : ) so can't be everywhere. Looking forward though, I think I should expand into some different farm products separate from the soap. Maybe it's a case of not putting all my eggs into one basket, but I also know there are learning curves to each new thing I add. I am a little torn between focusing solely on soap and B&B or offering a wider range of product to my existing base. I am already venturing into bees for the wax and honey. Some other things I am considering....
I already grow many herbs for the soap and am considering expanding this, perhaps offering plant starts and dried herbs. I have a small greenhouse.
Growing dried everlastings and making scented potpourri.
Angora Goats
What I can't see me doing...vegetable or meat sales, and milk sales are out of the question.
What are you doing???


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## hsmomof4 (Oct 31, 2008)

I'm not doing anything yet. Eventually. Hopefully when the markets open again in the spring. I have a friend who does soap (castille, FOs only), sugar scrubs, body butters, and GM laundry detergent. Her laundry detergent sells about the best of everything...maybe because no one else is doing that. She gets a lot of repeat customers with that. She also sells baked goods (like quick breads) and eggs and her oldest daughter sells cut flowers. Last spring when she was thinning out her blackberries, she sold starts and I know that went really well and cost her nothing.


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## Kalne (Oct 25, 2007)

We've tried three times to start bees. They've died off twice and disappeared completely another time. We are giving it one more try.

Because of our location we are going to try produce from our farm only, not wanting to take it to market along with everyone else.

We sell baked goods at the market. Do very well some weeks and others, well, let's just say we have plenty of dessert for a couple days. LOL

I would like to add candles since no one sells them at the markets we do. But I haven't been happy enough with my results to take the plunge, yet.


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## nightskyfarm (Sep 7, 2009)

I am a bit different in that I produce cheese and soap. Next spring and again in the fall, we will have a Jersey then two Jerseys in milk, to raise the goat kids primarily, but her milk will once more diversify the farm. The cows will be milked in the milking parlor aisle, as opposed to up on the goat platform where she won't fit , to keep all our milk graded. I plan on making butter for the markets and trying out some aged cow's milk cheeses. We actually have had a very good year until last month when the sales have dropped off, I think due to the economy. Jennifer


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## Guest (Dec 6, 2009)

Fiber is one way to go, I don't produce my own fiber but have access to Alpaca fiber, I knit and felt purses and once in a while other things.. alot of people are fasinated with felted items.. Needle felting is another way to go.. and you can do it in your down time


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## Faye Farms (Sep 14, 2009)

Diversity is a good thing to have on a farm in my opinion. If one thing does poorly one year you have other sales streams to pick up the slack. We have gone the meat and poultry sales route on our farm. I sell Pork, Ground Beef, Eggs and Soap at the farmer's market. Raising hogs has worked really well for us. I can sell as many pigs as I can raise. We also sell raw milk but I can't bring that to the farmer's market. 

Non-meat things that I see selling well at my markets are Jams/Jellies, anything Lavender, felted items, flower arrangements (our small market supports 2 and they both sell out!), Pepper Jellies, Baked Goods, Bakes Goods for Diabetics. One vendor just sells individual servings of scones and quick breads to be eaten on the spot. They do well all the time. Granola made from local ingredients. The one flower lady also pots up plants from her garden and they always all sell.


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## Jenny M (Nov 21, 2009)

Besides soap I do soy candles, shea cream (sells better than soap), bath salts. I also sell eggs & a few food items like granola, hummus & an olive salad that are great sellers. My farmer's markets are in tourist areas & I try to have items that a traveler would like. People want to eat something that does not come from a fast food place. 

The thing that is catching on the best for me, though, are my herb & salt blends. Especially a smoked chili salt that my husband thought of. I sell them in very nice little jars & people buy them up as fast as I can make them.

Like Barb, I'm getting very interested in fiber since those felted soaps sell so well. Felted items are very "in" these days. Alpaca is way "in". Wish I had a alpaca connection, too. Barb do your purses sell well? I bought one from a friend & just love it & want to make them myself.

When I started working on my product line, I looked around the markets to see who was doing what & tried to find things that were not being done. We have bakers, jam makers & veggie people so I just try to fill in with anything unique that I can make, package & sell fairly easily.


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## Guest (Dec 6, 2009)

Yes they do Jennie, that is how I got started, I purchased one from a gal and just loved it.. Paid 55.00 for it... Well I wanted to make them so I set about teaching my self how.. I already knew how to knit, so I knit them and then felt them.. I also have one that was not knitted.. my first love with felted items was a bowl that some 4H kids made for me.. and filled with candy.. I do not make a lot of them but I make nice one and embellish them nicely.. I can do it in down time since I can carry knitting with me just ab out anywhere.. Next I am going to try needle felting, starting out with making small animals.. or embellish purses with it.. I will post a pic of a couple of my purses on here tomorrow
Barb


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## Jenny M (Nov 21, 2009)

Barb, that's very encouraging. I haven't knitted for years but am taking it up again. I'm spending a lot of time in doctor & hospital waiting rooms these days (husband's health issues). The other day a lady said (after I had been waiting for a couple of hours) "Bet you wished you'd brought your knitting". She read my mind exactly.

With winter here & some down time it's a good opportunity for us to think about our next season & work on new products.

I'll look for your pics tomorrow. 

Thanks!


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## Terri-Lynn (Nov 7, 2007)

Yes I think diversity is going to be my motto for the year. I'm really known for my soap and get lots of repeat clients but want to use my booth space and time spent at the market well. Especially since it's once a week. I do 2 markets through the summer but only 1 year round. I'm really intrigued by angora goats, especially since I'm a knitter, but would only want to sell the fiber not finished items. There is someone at my market that sells spun wool, blankets and sheep skins though. BTW I'm also looking forward to pics Barb : )


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## Faye Farms (Sep 14, 2009)

My moms been working on some really cute little felted animals this past week. Ugg! we got some really nasty wool that we salvaged (it took us a long time to clean it) and she has been using that as the base. Then she's using Meilke's rovings for the outside. She's making christmas ornaments out of them. So far she has made some cute Penguins and Sheep. You know, last spring I blew out a bunch of eggs and decorated them for Easter. I attached ribbon hangers to them and hung them from a little tree. I wanted to bring some to market to sell but I never got around to trying it. But various little hanging ornaments would be a good thing to try at market.


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## Guest (Dec 7, 2009)

I will post a pic as soon as I can figure it out.. I am not so computer smart...
Barb


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## newbie nubian (Feb 7, 2009)

I'm very interested in this discussion, I'm hoping more of you will chime in (hint). I got bees in 2008 and got my first honey late this summer. I have sold a little bit of honey. I have mostly given it away and that was the reason I started the colonies of bees. I had quite a bit of beeswax so have made some products with that - some lotion bars and some lip balm. I also made a couple different kinds of soap with honey. I'm giving this all as gifts this year, but I got some really nice labels made and am hoping that I can sell some of these products in the future. 

I have the same questions that you do, Terri-Lynn and and am hoping to hear from others. Meat, milk, and/or vegetables are not really options for me either.


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## Aja-Sammati (Oct 26, 2007)

I am having jealousy fits reading these posts! The way our markets are set-up/regulated in CA, I have to have tw o separate booths in different sides of the market even if I want to bring my veggies. My soap isn't able to be a certified ag product because I didn't personally 'grow' the oil that is used in it, I just produced the goat milk. So my soap and veggies can't be in the same booth, because the veggies have to be certified (they make yo list everything upi will grow for the year & how much of it, pay a fee, then they come out to verify you are growing the things on your list, you can never sell anything not on your list each year. These are state laws, btw, not only market rules. To sell plants you have to be a licensed nursery AND a certified producer. To sell baked goods/jams/jellies, they must be produced in a commercial kitchen (costs about 10 grand to put up even a small one in a cheap metal building, a friend and I are working on it). A friend of mine sells LOTS of jams & jellies. SHe rents a kitchen to do them in...funny part is- if she buys the fruit or even picks it off a tree on the side of the road, it is okay, but since the apricot tree in her own yard isn't certified, she can't sell jam from its fruit at farmer's market! SHEESH!

Regulations to keep you safe...and broke, and stifle a free economy!


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## Faye Farms (Sep 14, 2009)

Wow Michelle, I'm glad I don't live in CA. All those rules are just ridiculous! It seems like they are trying to keep the small producers from making a good living. KS has pretty easy going market rules, at least I can live with them. LOL


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## Jenny M (Nov 21, 2009)

I had heard that CA was tough & only the big producers could manage all the regs to be able to sell. I don't see the reasoning behind it all but I'm sure it benefits some one (the big farms, maybe?). In Utah we have Cottage Food Rules & don't have to have a commercial kitchen. There are rules concerning your kitchen set up & labeling but they are pretty easy to abide by. Our market managers just want to see our food handlers cards & check over what we bring to make sure it looks acceptable.

The two markets that I do are very small & rely on the little backyard gardeners for produce. We are all small producers. This is not farming country so the market managers are thrilled to get just about any thing.

One important thing to consider. Before you go into production on a product make sure it's an approved item at the market you want to sell at. And find out & make sure you can comply with all the rules & regs - fed, state & local.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

What makes you the most money? For me it's soap, breeding stock, milk and everything else in that order. I don't have time to physically do more, so I wholesale in other products. I buy honey to use in soap in 5 gallon buckets and also repackage in mason jars for resale, I sold 8, 5 gallon buckets worth of honey and more than half of it was profit, I didn't have to do anything other than package it. I don't have time for bees and equipment, you would have to be doing it fairly bigtime to make much money over wholesale. I don't want to make the time to make candles etc...so I buy them from a gal on here, I also buy her room fresheners. I don't know how to do pottery, so I buy Lee's (buck run in the sticky up top) lotion bottles, soap dishes, shaving mugs etc., and resell them. I get the round shaving soaps made by a gal local to me who sells round soaps, I don't want to make time to make these. This year I am going to hire someone to do all the tolietries except raw shea. I simply make more money at soaping than making lotion or pumping and scenting and labeling lotion, body butter, etc...

So make sure in your diversification of your business, you add your labor and really see if it's making you money. Knitting or crochet which can be done on off hours, or even at your farmers market during the slow time is fine, but being nearly all labor, make sure you are charging for what it is worth.

Since seeing the felted soaps, I am going to buy these wholesale to offer also this year.

Wholesaling is the way to go, not only for your products, so others can wholesale them...but for expanding your business by selling retail what you purchase wholesale. 

Also really keep track of the farmers market costs vs profit. With fees, and labor, gas, food...especially if there is another soaper there, make sure it's the best use of your time. If you have enough sales, it's cheaper to higher someone to run your booth on commission so you can be home soaping, or milking etc... 

Have clear business goals. If you aren't reaching these goals figure out why and fix them. Vicki


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## Guest (Dec 8, 2009)

I think I might have this figured out, I can't load them from my hard drive, but think I can from photobucket..
http://s111.photobucket.com/albums/n139/B-vozar/?action=view&current=090.jpg]

http://s111.photobucket.com/albums/n139/B-vozar/?action=view&current=091.jpg]

Double click and these should give you a pic


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## Aja-Sammati (Oct 26, 2007)

If you can find wholesale stuff like Vicki can, be sure it is legal for you to sell at your farmer's market or craft fair, also. I know here you have to make it yourself, grow it yourself, especially at our craft fairs. If you can hire someone to sell at your booth, it helps if they can come ove rto your place and see the animals, production, etc. It makes them more knowlegible about the product they are selling, more connected to it, which makes them better sales people. Or hire a devoted soap customer  lot of my market sales come from the fact that every vendor at my markets use only my soap- I give them a bar and presto! my best sales reps.


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## Kalne (Oct 25, 2007)

Those are cute, Barb!

Technically, I can't sell honey at our market unless it comes from our hives. But if I had a local source I could sell it from the farm, just don't have that source. And our hives aren't producing. But I really want to get to that point.

Most of the shows we do we can sell 'accessories' that we don't make. Like my soap on an IKEA soap dish or my shaving soap in one of Lee's mugs. Now if I was selling from the farm I could do all of that (reselling) and it would make sense. I just don't have that outlet.

I'm with Vicki on this one.....when I crunch the numbers, hauling my wares to the shows, paying the fees, gas, time, etc., etc., my net is often the same as wholesale and I'd rather be home making soap.


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## Faye Farms (Sep 14, 2009)

Adding items that I can buy wholesale like Vicki is in our future planning for the farm. I can't do everything but I would like to offer my farm store customers a wider variety of local products. These would be things that I would sell here at the farm but not at any farmers market. We're thinking Honey would be a good place to start.


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## Guest (Dec 8, 2009)

When I first started out I did a few shows and markets, I now have enough business with word of mouth, my regulars (that are so very loyal) I do stay home and make soap.. better profit.. it just does not pay me any more to go unload, set up, and bring back home when My customers come to me.. but like I said to get known I had to when i first started... it is a relief not to do shows any more..
Barb


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## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

Our farmers mkt is minuscule because everyone who wants farm stuff does their own. 
Wow Barb and all-that is so wonderful that you can do it from home. We are tired of traveling as well so working on a way to have a studio/gallery at home but we are so rural don't know if it will work like festivals do for us. We plan to add plant starts and produce (like the mountain of Asian type winter squash in our barn!) to our pottery sales as well as the milk and cheese and eggs we are known for. Rabbits - both pet and fryer- chickens both show and layer. 
This is a neet thread. It's so nice to read what works for others and get new ideas. We used to do bees till Squidge got allergic and almost quit breathing on me! Love that homemade honey but bees are lots more trouble now.

I am hoping when we get our gallery area built to carry a selection of soaps and lotions from everyone here since I don't do that. Hope everyone keeps posting their marketing and alternative earning ideas. Love reading this.
Lee


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## Kalne (Oct 25, 2007)

Absolutely, Barb. Nearly every show I do produces a new repeat customer(s). Eventually I hope to get enough of them that I don't have to do shows anymore. Or at least cut way back. 

Heather....do you have a farm store on your property where you live? If so, how did that affect your taxes and insurance? Or are you off the beaten path enough that it goes unnoticed? Main reason I'm leaning toward a produce stand is that I think the red tape of having a small shop on the property will cost us too much (beyond the physical building). I don't think a simple produce stand will have that effect, but I need to check.


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## Faye Farms (Sep 14, 2009)

Kathy, at this point my little farm store is just a corner of my milk house. I have a separate fridge and freezer for the raw milk and frozen meats. I also have a large shelving unit for my soap. We would eventually like to have a separate building to hold the sales area but we are in the customer building phase right now. We need to see that the sales are going to be there to take it any further.

Barb, I'm so glad to hear from someone that has gone from doing markets and shows to being able to just stay at home and still get the sales. That is the place where I would like to get. I would like to do a show or market because I want to, not because I have to. I must say that after having 3 holiday shows under my belt I think my time is much better utilized at a farmer's market. Maybe it's just the year, but it seems like the people who attended the FM's came to buy. The people attending the Holiday Shows came for entertainment. I know the economy is down and it's hard to judge by just one year and 3 shows but I was very disappointed by how much money I made compared to how hard I worked. I just about killed myself last Saturday doing that big show. I didn't sit down all day working my booth but I still didn't bring in any more money than what I could do on a good farmer's market day. I'll probably give the holiday shows another try next year (especially if the economy turns around) but I'm not going to make any big plans to try to do a bunch of them.


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## Terri-Lynn (Nov 7, 2007)

" I must say that after having 3 holiday shows under my belt I think my time is much better utilized at a farmer's market. " I totally agree. I didn't do any craft type fairs this year and just kept up with my fm booth and wholesale accounts. I think it has been much more worth my while. This is why I want to concentrate on my booth and maximize my time there. Market rules don't allow me to wholesale other products though, I must produce these myself.


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## Jenny M (Nov 21, 2009)

I would love, love, love not to have to shelp those heavy baskets of soap back & forth but I'm not allowed to sell from home. I live at the back of beyond but am zoned residential estates & can't get a license to do anything but a home biz. I have to take or ship my products away to sell. Anyway, I'm very inconveient for customers. I use the market & shows to promote my biz & get accounts. I always have wholesale info to pass out to potential customers.

I'm working hard to get to the point where I have enough wholesale & internet orders to just stay home & produce. I have quite a few small shops & guest lodges but they are mostly seasonal. I now have an account with Amangiri (which is just down the road from my house) http://www.amanresorts.com/amangiri/home.aspx & make all their guest soap & now some retail products so hope to use that as an in to other private label accounts. They carry a lot of weight since they are the #1 luxury resort chain in the world.

Yes, set goals & know that you will have to work hard. You may have to give up a lot of time with your family so it might not be a good thing for you. if you can make a family biz then all the better. My children are grown & gone, my husband is disabled & limited in what he can do so I have to make a living someway. And this is something I can enjoy doing.


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