# Doe Freshened No Udder, very little milk



## PrairieTrail45 (Nov 28, 2011)

I have a 2 year old Nubian doe who freshened Monday night. She is from some pretty heavy milking lines, her dam milked over 8 lbs as a first freshener and was over 12 lbs as a 2nd freshener. This doe has practically no udder and very little milk. I have been milking her, although it is difficult because her teats are small and not filled in like they should be, and getting just under 1 lb of milk each milking. She had triplets, but they are small and very skinny. Two of the kids maybe weigh 4-5 lbs and the third is a little bigger at 7 lbs. They are doing well now, but were pretty weak when they were born. They don't have near the go that my kids usually have at birth and look like they were being starved to death. Other than bawling for her kids, the doe is fine. Eating, drinking and otherwise normal.

This does' half sister looks like she will do the same thing. Due to kid (yesterday) and has barely a hand full of an udder, at first glance you would not think either of these does had just kidded or were about to.

Both does are on Alfalfa hay, free choice pasture (grass), free choice minerals, copper bolused and they were given Mu-Se about 2 1/2 weeks pre-kidding (and before breeding). They have been getting some grain for the last 3 weeks also, in slightly increasing amounts so they were used to the grain before kidding. Both were wormed at 100 days with IvomecPlus, they were also wormed before they were bred. They are both first fresheners and are at a good weight, shiny coats and pink eyelids.

I asked my vet what he thought and he didn't have much insight as to the problem. He just said they were most likely not good moms and weren't going to be good producers, basically keeping all the nutrients for themselves.

I have had two other does freshen now, both Alpines, and they have plenty of milk and had nice strong, healthy kids. One even kidded 4 days early and hers are bigger and more feisty than the Nubians.

If it helps any, the biggest kid has a pretty normal coat length, the middle kid has a little bit shorter hair and the smallest kid has very short hair.

Any ideas? If it is a management issue, I would like to get it figured out so this doesn't happen again.


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## Hearts In Dixie (Oct 29, 2007)

*Re: Do Freshened No Udder, very little milk*

I have had a similar problem this year also. I am feeding all my does the same ration I have always fed. My doe had a nice udder the week before kidding then 7 days later when she kidded she didn't even have an udder. I thought maybe she was having a cloudburst because the udder went away before she delivered. I tried messaging and milking but there is nothing to milk out. She was new to my herd. I had her about two months before kidding. Another doe I purchased at the same time kidded and has milk but only about 3 lbs a day. These are full size Nubians. I have mini Nubis that freshen their first year with more than that. They were slim and svelt when I bought them but not too thin. By comparison to my minis they are thin but my minis are little butterballs. My only guess is that they did not have good nutrition prior to arrival at my farm. But I can't even challenge feed the one doe to make more.

Marla


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## Qadosh Adamah Lamanchas (Nov 2, 2012)

*Re: Do Freshened No Udder, very little milk*

Is her udder hard?


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## PrairieTrail45 (Nov 28, 2011)

*Re: Do Freshened No Udder, very little milk*

No her udder isn't hard, kind of firm, but still a little squishy. I've had both of these girls since they were kids. The one that kidded 4 days early is an Alpine and the same age as these and was also raised here and she has plenty of milk and her kids were normal size/weight for twins.

They are CAE Negative and came from a herd that has been CAE negative for years ( I saw the test results when I got them).

Whatever it is, it only has to do with these two.


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## nlhayesp (Apr 19, 2012)

*Re: Do Freshened No Udder, very little milk*

We have a nubian with a similar situation as a ff. We supplemented the kids with bottles. Last year, she had a proprotional udder for her size. She is a small, slender nubian and has always placed reserved grand at the fair. Her udder is very pretty, just not big. This year, third freshening, it is looking to be bigger.


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## dragonlair (Mar 24, 2009)

*Re: Do Freshened No Udder, very little milk*

There is a type of hay that inhibits milk production (fescue I think). Actually its a fungus that infects the fescue plant that causes the problems, at least in horses. I thought I had read that it can cause problems in does too. Just a thought.


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## Tim Pruitt (Oct 26, 2007)

*Re: Do Freshened No Udder, very little milk*

Keep milking her - the hormones might still kick in. In fact, I would milk her 3-4 times a day to stimulate milk production.


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## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

*Re: Do Freshened No Udder, very little milk*



dragonlair said:


> There is a type of hay that inhibits milk production (fescue I think). Actually its a fungus that infects the fescue plant that causes the problems, at least in horses. I thought I had read that it can cause problems in does too. Just a thought.


Good one, forgot about that.

The OP doe and the 1/2 sister; are they 1/2 sisters by the sire or the dam? If the sire, perhaps he doesn't come from milking lines?

CAE: Did YOU test yourself? Although with CAE, the udder would be rock-hard.


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## PrairieTrail45 (Nov 28, 2011)

*Re: Do Freshened No Udder, very little milk*

Yes they have the same sire. That was my thought also. He has a few kids that are a year older who were on milk test last year with good records. After looking around on ADGA Genetics, I did find a few does from the same breeder that were related to my girls who had very poor production their first year (2-3 lbs per test), then doubled the next year.

I have tested them myself twice, December 2011 and again October 2012 through Bio Tracking.

She does seem to be giving a little more milk every day, so I will keep milking her. I just wish she had longer teats!


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## swgoats (May 21, 2010)

*Re: Do Freshened No Udder, very little milk*

You know my doe Birdie milked poorly her first freshening, and her teat was small. (She only has one from a dog bite injury that happened before I got her.) She had one big buck. I milked her faithfully though as she was my first doe. Second year, ka boom, the milk came in. She's a favorite to milk, and her teat size is great.


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## hmcintosh (Jan 8, 2013)

*Re: Do Freshened No Udder, very little milk*

I had a doe do the same thing this yr as a FF. She had a udder that was not big but coming in days before kidding and after she kidded it went away. I have been bottle feeding the kids. She acted like she was afraid of them at the beginning and wouldn't stay with them now she talks to them and would let them eat but we decided to just raise them on the bottle. I didn't want to have to worry about them getting enough. I pretty much have been feeding the same way as you. So hopefully it will be like others say and next time things will be better. Don't need a doe that won't raise her kids.


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## smithurmonds (Jan 20, 2011)

*Re: Do Freshened No Udder, very little milk*

Angie, how do you empty the side with no teat?


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## swgoats (May 21, 2010)

*Re: Do Freshened No Udder, very little milk*

I can't. The first couple years it would get full of milk, and then dry up. Now it really doesn't even produce much milk at freshening. She produces nearly a gallon on the good side.


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## Bambitski (Mar 19, 2012)

*Re: Do Freshened No Udder, very little milk*

Do you feed them corn from a mill? I heard that corn and a few other grains are inhibiting the production of milk in some of the does. Because of the drought. Might be worth looking into.


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