# HELP doe trying to kid something dead



## Madeleine M. (Oct 26, 2007)

Red is a small 100 lb unregistered 6-7 year old Nubian, but she is new to my heard. This morning she had some pink goo, so I went in and she was only dilated one finger. she was acting fine, and we needed to pick up a bottle steer, so she went back in the stall. At 5 I went in again, I could feel a bubble and decided to wait for her to push it out. Around 8:30, she started pushing, and I could a small portion of the bubble with every push. Then the water broke, and stank horribly so I put her on a milk stand and went back in. Bits of what looked like scrambled egg were all in the fluid. I could feel something hard, round, and big, nothing like a goat kid. I called my vet (who is currently in Florida) and he said that it sounded like a mummified kid in a ball position, and he did not think she could kid it. He said to find a goat person near by to either c section, or cut up the kid. I don't know if anyone can come this late at night, but all suggestions are welcome.
By the way, this goat's twin sister had at least 6 week early stillborns (they were at least 6 weeks early, not atl east 6 kids) 2 weeks ago, and a dwarf doe in a different pen had a still born 2 months ago. These are the first deaths I have had in 3 years of goats, so I think they may be related somehow.

Thanks 
Madeleine


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## Madeleine M. (Oct 26, 2007)

adding that she does not have a fever and is not breathing hard, or grinding her teeth.


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## doublebowgoats (Mar 6, 2008)

I'm so sorry this is going on! Have you been able to get hold of anyone?


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## stacy adams (Oct 29, 2007)

Good Grief! I'd go in and try to re-arrange.. that's about the best you can do at this point, and get that kid out. Even if you get it out breech, which I'm thinking may be easier, as you wouldn't have the head to deal with.. but either way. I don't know anything about cutting up a kid while it's still inside. I did have a friend years a go twist off a leg, but egads.. if you can get a hold of the thing, and aimed in the right direction....


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## Madeleine M. (Oct 26, 2007)

I talked to the breeder (who is near Dallas) and she said that it could be a cloud burst or even cancer. I can not get anything to rearrange, or feel any kid- like parts or limbs. She told us to watch Red tonight, but let her take care of her business unless she becomes distressed.
Thanks for the replies
Madeleine


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## goatkid (Oct 26, 2007)

Is there another vet who can check her? With a cloudburst I don't think she'd be pushing out a foul smelling bubble. I had a doe with a dead kid inside her last summer. She had that pink goo and strange stuff came out of her before my friend pulled out a dead kid. The strange stuff is likely the afterbirth which has begun decomposing. Does frequently cannot deliver dead kids on theri own. You don't want the cervix to close. If she has a fused mummy inside her, you need help delivering it.


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## Madeleine M. (Oct 26, 2007)

We found another vet, and are leaving now to take her in.


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## tmfinley (Feb 21, 2008)

Let us know how she's doing.


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## trueblessings (Mar 10, 2008)

Any word on her condition.

Lynn


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## Sondra (Oct 25, 2007)

oxy and lute would have been in order last night. and with all these deaths you need to start them all on the tetracyline crumbles I would think. 
Let us know what happens at the vet.


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## Oat Bucket Farm (Mar 2, 2009)

I hope the vet can help and the doe comes through this okay.


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## catdance62 (Mar 2, 2009)

keep us posted. I am interested in the outcome


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## Madeleine M. (Oct 26, 2007)

It turned out to be a giant, dead buckling who was rolled into a ball. The vet couldn't do a C-section, because he did not want to release that toxic fluid into her blood stream. His hands were too large to get the kid out, so he coached me as I pulled him out. He had to cut up the buckling as I got parts out. It was pretty awful.

She is getting Banamine and Biomyocin, and drinking a little Gatorade. My job is to make sure that she is eating and drinking more today.


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## goatkid (Oct 26, 2007)

I'm so glad you took her to the vet and got that kid delivered. Good job. I hope she'll be OK for you. My doe did OK after her dead kid was pulled.


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## Madeleine M. (Oct 26, 2007)

Her temperature is dropping. I just put a sweater on her, and gave her sub Q fluids.


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## Anita Martin (Dec 26, 2007)

Oh that sounds so awful. I'm so glad you had a vet that would coach you like that. I'm sure it was much better for the doe than a c-section. Good luck.
Can you set her up safely under a heat lamp or in a heated area?


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## mamatomany (Aug 7, 2008)

Poor baby....praying for her


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## Patty13637 (Oct 26, 2007)

Temp dropping is not a good sign . What do you have on hand ? What dosage of antibiotics are you giving and how much banamine , how many times a day ?

Patty


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## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

Shock- is she shivering? Make her walk around. If they lay around after a trauma like that they will crash. She needs to move some regularly. Circulation and digestion all work better with walking. If she stops drinking get some subq fluids going so she does not dehydrate. The potential exists that some damage was done to the uterine wall but I would expect elevated temp with that.
If she has infection that has moved to the blood stream from the dead fetus she may suffer septic shock and you will have to work very diligently to bring her out of it. Don't let her dehydrate. Ask your vet about these symptoms and the temp drop. Don't delay.
Good luck that is quite an ordeal for you but glad you have medical support.
Lee


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## Sondra (Oct 25, 2007)

Did he flush he out? call Vicki don't wait for answers here


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## Madeleine M. (Oct 26, 2007)

The vet did flush her out. He also gave her Exenel. I don't think that is spelled right. I'm giving her sub Q fluids, 1 cc of Banamine, and 6 cc of Bio Mycin. She is holding on, but it is touch and go at this point.


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## stacy adams (Oct 29, 2007)

Sending prayers for your doe!!


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Is he giving you excenel to keep her on for the next 4 more days? Give her enough banamine, now isn't the time to worry about using it, give her the full 1cc per 100 pounds twice a day until she is feeling better. If she is in pain she won't make it. Milk her, getting her oxytocin flowing to get that uterus shrunken down will go a long way in making sure she will be able to be bred again if she lives through this. Biomycin is given at 3.5cc per 100 pounds, up the amount if you are giving less than that and you can give it twice a day if he doesn't have her on Excenel also. Make sure and give it subq, no matter what the vet said. Tempt her to eat as much as you can, perhaps go pick up some new hay she doesn't usually get.

Sorry I didn't get back with you. With your ability to go in like I knew you could, there was little I was going to be do on the phone for help, and with does due, I can't leave my farm right now. Vicki


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## red farmer (Feb 5, 2009)

Prayers for you. and hope doe is holding her own tonite.

Jacque


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## Madeleine M. (Oct 26, 2007)

She is nibbling feed tonignight YEAY
The vet did not give me any excenel, I don't know how much he gave her, but he said that it would stay effective in her system for days (wrong for goats, right on cows). She weighs 100 lbs, so... do I break the dose into 1/2 2x daily, or am I doing it right? She did not have any milk tonight, but I think she is borrowing her sister's buckling (sister gave more milk). We syringe fed her orally 1 full water bottle, and a full Gatorade around noon, 8oz of milk and 4 oz of Gatorade around 5, and 10cc water just now, is she good on fluids for the night, or do I need to wake up to give her more?

Thanks Vicki, but compleatly undeserved, I felt it's shoulder blades, and was compleatly sure they were eye sockets on a monkey skull 
(note title of this thread is something dead, not dead kid)


Thanks
Madeleine


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

A doe drinks gallons of water a day, why giving water orally is so futile. Get the lactated ringers and give it to her subq. Make a big buldge under the skin up by her shoulder, make another one on the other side when that one is half gone. It will make her feel so much better to be hydrated. Good luck! Vicki


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## Madeleine M. (Oct 26, 2007)

Madeleine M. said:


> She weighs 100 lbs, so... do I break the byo Mycin dose into 1/2 2x daily, or am I doing it right?


She is drinking water on her own, and is acting much better.

My vet is in town agian, and he said he could get me some more exenel if she needed it.

Thanks
Madeleine


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## doublebowgoats (Mar 6, 2008)

Oh, things sound better. Sorry I don't know the answer to your questions about the meds, but I do beleive you should get more of the antibiotic since what she had isn't enough to treat a goat for infection.


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## Oat Bucket Farm (Mar 2, 2009)

Glad things sound like they are getting better.


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## Sondra (Oct 25, 2007)

no you give the full dose twice a day.


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## Madeleine M. (Oct 26, 2007)

I was told to use 6 cc per day, Vicki said either 3.5 twice a day, or twice 3.5cc once a day, (I couldn't tell which). So, what do you consider to be a full dose?


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## pokyone42 (Oct 26, 2007)

good luck!


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

You use OTC antibiotics once a day profilactically, when you are staving off wound infection etc....when ill, fever etc, you move to every 12 hours. In this case I would give it every 12 hours for a few days, then if no fever, go to once a day to continue the treatment....tetracyclines for 10 days is fine if you feel the need...pennicillin be careful, you can have reaction to it on it's 7th shot, you never know when it is going to happen....have epi on hand. Vicki


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