# best milk replacer??



## peppersmom (Feb 26, 2013)

ok long and short of the story: lost all my goats to the hatefullness of a family member. now i'm starting over with what breeds I want at my own place with all my own stuff. i have purchased (but not yet picked up because of weather) a 2 week old oberhasli doeling. she has her papers, a tetanus vaccination, tattoo, and been disbudded. she is on goat milk and the seller is sending me with at least a gallon maybe 2 gallons and i have one gallon frozen but i will have to switch her to milk replacer. i know i have to use one designed for kids specifically but i don't know what to look for. as far as farm and ranch supply stores i have an orscheln's, an atwoods, and an hour away there is a TSC. other than that online is my only other source.

in the past when hand rearing i've used the black lamb nipple on a 20 oz pop bottle. this method always seemed to either run milk down their windpipes or make them suck air and bloat. is there a better method for one or two kids? (i plan on getting at least one more bottle baby)

also one quick question about the breeder i'm buying from. she disbudded this little girl at only a few days old! is that normal/acceptable? i was taught to wait until the horns broke through the skin usually 4-6 weeks. i have a lot of re-learning to do. the more i research the more i learn that was taught to me incorrectly.


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## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

PLease just use whole cow milk from the store. There is very little structural difference in cow and goat milk. Negligible differences. Far less different than any kind of 'formula'. Anything manufactured is going to cause digestive upset. Normally they are too high in fat. Good luck!


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## peppersmom (Feb 26, 2013)

doesn't the cows milk make much bigger curds making it harder to digest? isn't that why people who have trouble with cow milk do well on goat milk?


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## smithurmonds (Jan 20, 2011)

I raised my first kids on whole cow's milk from the grocery store with no issue.


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## MayLOC (Oct 26, 2007)

It is common to disbud at an early age like a few days old.
They really do very well with store bought whole cow milk. I do not have experience with milk replacer and goat kids, but have seen plenty of little pot bellied calves raised on milk replacer and know the ones that we raise on goat milk are equal or better looking then their herd mates.


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## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

You are thinking in terms of human digestion. 
For a baby goat- cow milk is going to grow them out just fine!

Lee


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## Ashley (Oct 25, 2007)

peppersmom said:


> doesn't the cows milk make much bigger curds making it harder to digest? isn't that why people who have trouble with cow milk do well on goat milk?


Milk replacer is going to be made from either soy or cow milk products anyway. And the cow milk products in it are only going to be inferior to whole milk.


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## peppersmom (Feb 26, 2013)

ok. there is a cow dairy not far from here where i can purchase raw milk would that be better than store bought? (i think it'll be cheaper also)

and i'm all for using milk instead of milk-replacer as i raised both my children on goats milk instead of formula when i couldn't breast feed. i was just taught (again learning everything i was taught was wrong) that milk replacer for kids was better than cows milk. which is why i'm researching  thanks for all the info


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## Ashley (Oct 25, 2007)

Raw milk is great and what I feed mine but from my own cow. I don't know that I would want to use pooled raw milk.. I'd be concerned about possible diseases or even mastitis strains. But if it's cheaper, you could pasteurize it.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Yep, until milk replacers state "will not kill small ruminants' please don't feed them. They are made with whey or soy, neither of which is close to raw milk.

Of course if you can use whole cow milk from a farm, use it, the incidence of Johnnes passed in milk is really low, it is mostly a disease of manure/filth ingested orally by calves and kids. Vicki


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## Anita Martin (Dec 26, 2007)

And yep, disbudding at a few days old is preferable to waiting until the horns are big and take a whole lot of burning to get them off! It's much easier on the baby done at an early age. And yes to the store bought cows milk. It's already pasturized! I hope you got to see their herds CAE negative papers?


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## peppersmom (Feb 26, 2013)

she says she has them but i haven't seen them yet. (CAE papers that is) anything else i need to ask for? i'll be joining ADGA and AGS next week. and i'm still searching for a nigerian dwarf doeling.


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## peppersmom (Feb 26, 2013)

this is what was used on the farm i grew up on

http://www.orschelnfarmhome.com/kid-milk-replacer-4-lb/ctl16754/cp58395/si5184320/cl1/


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## doublebowgoats (Mar 6, 2008)

Regular cow's milk from the store is just so much better in my experience. No scours. Welcome to the forum, by the way!


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## nlhayesp (Apr 19, 2012)

I disbud when the babies are old enough to start jumping. To me,that is a sign that they vigorous enough to withstand the assault with the disbudding iron. It is always when they are a few days old. You want to get them before they break the skin, when they are just "buttons" and you have lower chance of scurs.
I have always used milk replacer; but on the advice of this column, my latest bottle baby is on whole cows milk. (I am continuing to add 1 can of whole milk evaporated milk and 1 cup whole buttermilk/ gallon as well). She is a boer goat, and this was recommened by a boer breeder. She is growing well, no scours, etc.


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## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

Personally, I would not feed raw milk from cows. If you can get it cheaper than store-bought milk, get it and pasteurize it. Please don't use a milk replacer. Some on here have had success, but it seems that is very rare.

And IMO, disbudding SHOULD be done early, not in 4 - 6 weeks. I disbud by day 5, otherwise I end up with scurs. I would think if you waited 4 - 6 weeks you'd be talking de-horning, not disbudding.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

nlhayesp why would you add to low fat products to your goatmilk and decrease the fat? I have never really understood that formula, plus you just add to the expense with zero value added to the milk.

And welcome to the forum! Vicki


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## Blackbird (Jan 11, 2013)

I used Land O Lakes brand 'Does Match' last year.. I would never feed it as the sole source of milk, always half and half with whole goat or cow milk, if that. It worked 'alright', but I could tell differences between each bag, and the store had no problem selling bags they got in the year before.. Or we'd have to wait for them to get a new shipment in.. Just way too much hassle when you have goat kids relying on you.

As far as cost, gallon to gallon, very similar cost to whole cow milk from the store. Based on that I will not feed it again, when, as dead as store milk is, this is even deader.. LOL


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## Cotton Eyed Does (Oct 26, 2007)

Store bought whole cow milk works great. One year I found a deal on a BUNCH of Carnation powdered milk and I raised some beautiful babies on it. No problems what so ever. If you do go with a milk replacer from Tractor supply use the one that has whole milk solids in it. It is probably going to be more expensive than buying whole milk from the grocery store. 
Another thought: Maybe you could lease the Mama doe who is in milk for about 3 months?? OR you could lease another doe who is in milk, milk her and bottle feed the baby. But Please make sure she is CAE negative first.


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## Texasgirl (Feb 28, 2013)

My entire herd is made up of abandoned kids, didn't pay a cent for any of them. I fed 4 of my 6 goats Land O' Lakes Goat Milk Replacer and never had any problems (two came to me already weaned). The vet likes that brand too. I live far from town and so obtaining even enough pasteurized cow's milk to feed growing kids would be a major hassle. I just took over some left over milk replacer power to a friend who was just given a kid whose ears were chewed off. The kid was not doing well at all, had scours bad and was pretty weak when I arrived. He was being fed 2% cows milk mixed with buttermilk, which is when he came down with a severe case of the runs. I made him some diluted milk replacer, fed him a little and he really perked up. By the next day he was running and jumping everywhere and his human momma started giving him full strength milk replacer.


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## Liss (Jul 20, 2010)

*best milk replacer*

I know these are standard sized goats - but is the pritchard nipple too small for them? I had one of those lamp nipples from Hoeggers and my goats are Nigerians - lol - they almost choked - so I saw that - one would have to watch until the other finished the bottle. lol

luck with you goats! true love. ^^


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## nlhayesp (Apr 19, 2012)

Vicki McGaugh Tx Nubians said:


> nlhayesp why would you add to low fat products to your goatmilk and decrease the fat? I have never really understood that formula, plus you just add to the expense with zero value added to the milk.
> 
> And welcome to the forum! Vicki


! - How is adding whole milk evaporated milk and whole milk cultered buttermilk lowering the fat? They are whole milk products being added to whole milk. 2- a friend that raises boers said that her vet, as well as the vets at OSU vet school said that 2% is good for her boer bottle babies since they put on fat easily. 
Where I live in Central Ohio, a gallon of milk is $2.50 (usually one store in the area has it on sale for this, or cheaper) When it is cheaper, I freeze some. A half gallon of whole milk buttermilk from Kroger is $1.30 or so, sometimes less if it is close to the expiration date. I freeze it in 1 cup portions. The evaporated milk I got for $0.47/can. So, per gallon, I am paying $2.78 and haven't lowered the fat, and have somewhat increased the calcium (evaporated milk), as well as adding beneficial bacteria for her. My boer bottle baby is growing well, is very active and very vigorous and has really good condition; not fat, not skinny, good digestion, etc.


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## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

Are you sure the buttermilk is whole fat? Because around here, not one store carries whole fat buttermilk, it is all low fat.


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## nlhayesp (Apr 19, 2012)

Our Kroger is the only store around us that carries whole milk buttermilk. Actually, I never looked at Meijer, since I usually shop at Kroger as it is close. It is on the bottom shelf of the refrigerator, right next to the lowfat version. Since I buy it and freeze it, I don't have a label to re-check, but when I was at Kroger yesterday, I looked at the label again just to be sure. It has a gold label with red writing, and I think it has a red top, just like whole milk.


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## peppersmom (Feb 26, 2013)

jeez! milk here is $4.89/gal!!!! and that's the off brand cheap stuff! highland is over $5! which is why i was looking into buying from the dairy. 

i picked up the baby on friday and am not cutting her goat milk 1/2 and 1/2 with whole cows milk from the store. so far so good i just started it today. she's ruuuuuunin and boooouncin! love it!


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## Liss (Jul 20, 2010)

I got this online - sure looks expensive compared to cow's milk. ^^ Like the other replies - I think your kids will do just fine on cows milk ^^


*Homemade Milk Replacer for Kids*

There aren't any good products around the house and you don't have time togo find any. Here's a recipe compliments of Coni Ross, CR Ranch.

1 cup of nonfat dry milk (any generic grocery store versionwill do)
3 cups warm water
1 large egg
1/4 cup whipping cream

1 scoop Calf Pac (live probiotic product containing 5 viableorganisms)

Mix with a mixer or food processor. Do not microwave.

To double the recipe: double water, milk, leave whippingcream the same, use a jumbo egg.

To triple: triple water, milk, 1/3 cup whipping cream, 2large eggs.

Egg has all of the essential amino acids, fatty acids, andvitamins except vitamin C.

Coni says, "This recipe will grow kids as well as their owndam


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## Liss (Jul 20, 2010)

that is crazy for milk to be that high! Course, I'm not a dairy farmer. Here in Eugene OR - it is $2.48 gallon. But then again - gas is $3.80 ga. ;/


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## peppersmom (Feb 26, 2013)

thanks for the recipe. our gas is $3.59 so not much lower  and naturally the closest grocery store is 25 miles away....


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## adillenal (Feb 6, 2009)

The cheapest whole milk in my area is $3.78 then $3.95 then $4.68. Wal-Mart, Dollar Store and the local chain grocery. It is not a good solution for me to use whole cow milk from the grocery store. Sometimes, I have to use goat milk, milk replacer AND the cow milk to stretch it far enough for the little milk suckers.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Raw eggs to infant goatlings?

Here buttermilk and evaporated milk both have considerably lower fat than whole grocery store milk, which is already low in fat.

What we are all saying is that we have for decades used whole grocery store milk, all the does on my website have been raised this way with goatmilk selling for $8 to $10 a gallon here, closer to Houston upwards of $14 a gallon, I make a deal with a local grocer to take all his getting old milk for $1 a gallon. Why add so much more expense with no value added to it for the goatlings with so much success with just whole vitamin D Grocery store milk? Vicki


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## peppersmom (Feb 26, 2013)

i do think it will be more economical to buy whole milk than milk replacer even with it being almost $5/gal. it's $25 for the smallest bag of milk replacer. she seems to be doing fine on the 1/2 and 1/2 right now no change in her stools.


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## fmg (Jul 4, 2011)

Ew, why would you feed a goat kid eggs??


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## peppersmom (Feb 26, 2013)

protein? lol!


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## peppersmom (Feb 26, 2013)

i have seen people add an egg to calf milk replacer and their calves had phenomenal growth rates.


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## fmg (Jul 4, 2011)

Huh. If we have excess eggs or they're getting old, or we find old ones, we have fed them to the dogs-makes their coats nice and shiny.


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## Liss (Jul 20, 2010)

isnt it funny how we ask questions - and then question the answers? LOL - I do the same thing LOL


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## Liss (Jul 20, 2010)

eggs - amino acids?? somewhere in the back of mind - I can almost know the answer to that. ^^ oh well..... ;/


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## fmg (Jul 4, 2011)

I do know that there is some kind of vitamin deficiency (biotin?) with consuming raw eggs. Don't know how many you have to eat to have that happen, though.


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## smithurmonds (Jan 20, 2011)

Even if you were considering raw eggs, I wouldn't dare feed raw grocery store/commercially produced eggs to a kid. I don't feed my kids anything other than actual milk, whole cow's milk before we had our own does fresh and now just goat's milk.


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## Ashley (Oct 25, 2007)

The biotin thing isn't a big concern as the biotin in the yolk is supposed to make up for it. (It's the white that binds it up)


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## fmg (Jul 4, 2011)

Thanks for clearing that up, Ashley. I'm still grossed out by feeding goats eggs! My kids, like Nick's, don't get anything but milk. Okay, once in a while a little whey if I have it and don't know what else to do with it (don't mix with milk or you get cheese!), and my kids are older, near weaning age.


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## doublebowgoats (Mar 6, 2008)

I have added cream to a struggling kid's bottle before, a kid that wasn't able to take much milk at a time. Considering how high in fat most of my does' milk is, I figured it might make it more like the real stuff. 
I also have fed whey to my bucks or near-weaning-age kids, but not for babies.


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## peppersmom (Feb 26, 2013)

wouldnt feeding them whey make some kind of weird science experiment in their stomachs?


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## fmg (Jul 4, 2011)

The same weird science experiment that is already happening in there.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Whey is a main ingredient in most protein drinks, in milk replacers that are not soy, and baby formulas  Also considered a toxic waste, it can not be dumped down sewers in Texas. Vicki


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