# Prebreeding bose



## Ashley (Oct 25, 2007)

OK, I know I asked this recently, but can't find my post. When do you give bose prebreeding (does). What's the latest it can be given? 

Thanks. :blush2


----------



## trnubian (Mar 12, 2008)

You CAN give Bo-Se anytime of the year. However, it should be given to bucks and does about 4-6 weeks prior to breeding in order to be at it's full effect. Selenium can also alter the fertility of a buck temporarily so if you haven't done it yet I would plan on giving it tomorrow and starting you breeding season in mid September. They CAn still breed does during the 4-6 week period, they just aren't nearly as fertile. 

Does need it ahead of time to help with their fertility and to get ready for the coming pregnancy. I give it about a month ahead of breeding and then not again until they are about 6 weeks from their due date. I don't like messing with them too much when they are short bred.


----------



## Sondra (Oct 25, 2007)

I give it 30 days prior to breeding and 2 week prior to freshening.


----------



## MiaBella Farm (Jul 22, 2008)

Sondra,

You give the does BoSe 30 days prior to breeding and 2 weeks prior to kidding? Interesting, I had not read that before. I am learning something new! The Birth til Kidding in Dairy Goat 101 does not spell that out...maybe it is just personal preference or should that be a general rule of thumb?

So, the BoSe 2 weeks before kidding...does that help out the kids too? I know they need the BoSe right after they are born, so just curious on this.

Thanks!


----------



## Theresa (Oct 26, 2007)

I do the same as Sondra. I give my does the bose the first of whatever month they are going to be bred. So say I am going to breed them in September, everyone gets their shot around the end of August or 1st of September so it might not be 30 days. I have found that I am more likely to get multiples if I do it this way then if they don't get bose or has been awhile since they have received a shot of it. Then they get another about 2 weeks before kidding. Some might be closure to kidding because I like to do it as a group and get everyone done. 

Now, you want to do the bucks about 30 days before you are going to use them because it can decrease their sperm count. 
Theresa


----------



## Sondra (Oct 25, 2007)

the closer you give the BoSe prior to freshening (even a week before) the more immunity you are hopefully imparting to the kids however my kids still get a shot at birth and a Vit E capsul.


----------



## icboers (Feb 1, 2009)

I was told by my vet (a great goat vet), that BoSe should not be given to anything under 7 weeks of age. But most on here say they give it to newborns, could someone explain the difference in opinions on this?

Karla


----------



## Sondra (Oct 25, 2007)

Karla most Vets don't even recommend BoSe at all so have no clue as to why he won't give it to newborns. This I have done for over 5 yrs now so it works for me.


----------



## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

I do the same Teresa and try for 30 days out from breeding and one week from kidding and think it does contribute to multiples as well as more vital kids. I had does from the same line that produced dopey kids that would have to be taught to find the teat. With bose close to kidding- kids of the same cross now jump up and head for chow before they are even cleaned. 

I believe the problem you are citing with bose in bucks is sperm motility not sperm count. 
There are plenty of sperm there but they don't move as quickly. 
Lee


----------



## MiaBella Farm (Jul 22, 2008)

OK thanks everyone for clearing that up! :biggrin


----------



## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

I don't spell out everything in my paper because it is preference. We have antidotal evidence and that's about it. I give bo-se to my girls as close to before breeding as I can get, and if you read the article about what is and what isn't in colostrum (used to be up on saanendoah.com and I think Sue Reith got the info together???) selenium is one of things not found until milk, so giving kids shots at birth is common practice.

The biggy for me is that although most consider my vet to be a really excellent goat vet in our area, she is only such because she took care of Blissmor Farms, Sun Trap farms and Autumns retreat before I started using her in 86. So although she perscribes and gives out bo-se to all my goat friends, she does not give out this information to folks not asking about it...although she worms goats with Ivermectin, she still gives injectable information...it's what she learned in school. Giving 1cc per 40 pounds of bo-se is NOT treating defficency, it is about bolstering, more kids, healthier kids at birth and good sucking relfex even in the littlest of quads or quints. Bo-se is so diluted you can give it monthly with no ill effects at all, and the boost to blood level is several dropped by 3 weeks, so I would not be giving doe doses too far from breeding, or you won't get he value...well other than eggs and sperm are made ahead of time. Vicki


----------



## Freestep (Jun 24, 2009)

Does the vitamin E/selenium oral gel work the same as the Bo-Se injection? I have some of the former, but I'm guessing the injectable is an Rx because I can't find it anywhere.


----------



## Ashley (Oct 25, 2007)

Bo-se is from a vet.

I'm curious about your first question as well.


----------



## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

No- if oral selenium worked they would get enough from all the seeds they eat. Alfalfa also contains selenium if grown properly. This was part of the experiments in grazing meat goats on Brassica rapa (rape) as it is also full of selenium if it is in the soil.
Vit E is also in all seeds that are not degraded. Since we are all feeding seeds of some form or another it is either the degradation of the seeds in storage and processing or the lack of selenium in the soil they were grown in or the goat just can't pick it up in digestion. There are so many variables in the ration and ability to process injection is just the most sure way to raise levels.
It is also much faster to correct deficiencies with injection.
Lee


----------



## dragonlair (Mar 24, 2009)

I give my goats BoSe a month or so before breeding, just before kidding and then the newborns get a dose within 12 hours of birth. The rest of the time they get a dose of the oral gel once a month.


----------



## Sondra (Oct 25, 2007)

No the oral doesn't work as well as the injectable but given enough it will help


----------



## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

With the economy like it is, I wish someone would do blood test levels on the selenium gels to see if it's just busy work or really works...anyone up for this? Just can't see given out advice that wastes money. Vicki


----------



## dragonlair (Mar 24, 2009)

I haven't done blood work on them, but mine seem to do better when they get the monthly squirt of the gel along with the pre-breeding and pre-kidding shots of BoSe. (or post kidding kid shots) I would not rely on the gel alone.


----------



## Bethany (Jan 9, 2008)

I haven't done any blood work either, but last year I gave each doe one click of gel a month before breeding. In all my years of goat raising I had never had a set of triplets...well this year I had LOTS of trips, sooo maybe the gel did something!


----------



## Aja-Sammati (Oct 26, 2007)

My herd averages triplets...
I do the boys one month out, and the girls 3 weeks out. I also do them one week before kidding and on our vet's advice now once 3 months after that. So everyone gets 3 BoSe shots a year. I guess should do blood work...but I think it is cheaper to just give the goats BoSe.

I am going through almost 3 bottles of BoSe a year (45-70 goats in the last year)- $90
One Selenium level test- $15-120 (dependent on labs)
So it all depends on how many times/goats you are going to screen...

If you are already using BoSe you would need more than one test, another in 3 months to see if your levels have changed...so I'd have that charge again. And what if the levels are really low at that 3 month mark- you might have a sick goat. It seems pretty safe to just BoSe if you live in a deficient area, or test your hay or forage for selenium levels to see if it is deficient (extension offices do forage tests). To get an accurate picture, you would really need to do a year of screening to monitor your levels.


----------

