# Have you considered DHIR?



## Aja-Sammati (Oct 26, 2007)

Now is a great time to think about it! I know many people think it is too time consuming, too expensive, and won't do anything for their breeding program, but I am here to encourage everyone to reconsider for several good reasons:

*1- * ADGA has a new program that allows owner/sampler results to gain actual records (Advanced Registry) instead of just milk stars. In this new program you have to have a minimum of 8 tests and 240 days in milk, and a verification test that falls in between 60 & 150 days in milk. You do have to take tester training yourself, and have it verified by the association for your area (I know that some areas have a video they mail to you, they are working on an online training here.) Does will not be eligible for Top Ten on this new program.
This program makes DHIR more affordable, as you only have to pay a tester for the verification test, not every month. You would mail your own samples, except for the verification test.

*2- * Testing isn't as expensive as people think. ADGA just changed the fee schedule also- before you paid a base fee each year + $1 per doe. Now there is no charge per doe, and the base fee is charged on how many does there are on test. This year I will pay $75 (36 does) which is cheaper than I would have paid the old way. 1-5 does is $45, 6-25 does is $50
I try to have all of my tubes for the year mailed to me at one time, so I don't have to pay shipping back to me each month. I mail my samples to the lab priority mail, which for 20 samples is about $6. I have about 20 does on test, get a lot of the extra reports that I find useful (Provo has a lot of options, some other associations don't have as many), and I pay about a $1 each doe each month. If you add in the divided cost of yearly shipping and ADGA fees, plus monthly test fees, I pay about $18 per year per doe. For this I get concrete numbers that tell me what a sire is doing, how does are really producing, numbers that show me if a doe is financially viable, proof to customers on how the does are milking with the management I use, milk stars, sire recognition, and since I also appraise- Superior Genetics eligibility.

*3-* Testing provides genetic tool for better breeding choices. Lets pretend you want to raise your herd butterfat & protein for cheese production (for you, or to sell does to a cheese dairy, etc.) You search around and buy the best buck you can afford, with records behind him that show he should raise butterfat/protein. How do you know he did? Test results from daughters on test may show that he raised butterfat in some does, or lowered it. I have a doe line that the daughters are underproducers in butterfat, no matter which buck they are sired by- I haven't found the buck that will raise their butterfat numbers yet, probably I won't ever, and most of them will get phased out of my breeding program. This is just one example, you could use test results to choose between two similar does, to see that one doe never produces daughters that milk enough, or that one sire doesn't, etc. Or you can just use it to prove your animals are good- a marketing tool.

*4- * Herds on test are needed to improve the dairy goat industry. A stat I heard last weekend was that when a lot of Holstein herds in CA went on test in 1952, the average Holstein milked 12,000 lbs a year. By using DHIR and classification, the average Holstein in CA now milks around 23,000 lbs a year. The cow dairymen believe that this kind of progress was made because using of DHIR as a tool. Dairy cow people are more farsighted about this than most dairy goat people. Did you know that the dairy goat industry is one of the fastest growing segments of the economy? With an 18 percent market share growth even in last years sucky economy? Yet dairy goat herds are notorious for not testing, not having concrete tools/numbers to use to back up breeding decisions & sales. We can't move dairy goats forward as _dairy_ animals unless we have concrete numbers to base sire selection on. I know most people on this list aren't interested in an animal that only shows, and doesn't milk, and many of us go to herds that appraise and test to buy animals, yet we aren't using those tools to prove our animals (which also proves the animals we bought.) The more goats on test, the more accurate the prediction numbers, the more each breed moves forward as a whole.

These were the big reasons I could think of off the top of my head. I know DHIR can be daunting, but there are people on test that can help you understand how to read a performance pedigree, how to fill out the test forms, how to make the local associations return your calls , people to help you get the most out of your test results. Lisa Sheperd, who does ADGA Performance Programs, is always available by email and is very helpful. In the ADGA office they have always been helpful in figuring out how you fill out the application as a new herd- after that they send you currently owned lists and renewal applications each year . On this list Tracy (Soldier MTN), Janet Cooper (2-G Farm), Rett (Narrow Chance), and myself, as well as others I am sure I don't remember right now, are either on test or have been on test. Feel free to ask questions!

Okay- I'm off my soapbox now


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## Ashley (Oct 25, 2007)

Thanks for all that info. It is something I have been considering. Probably not this year, but maybe next.


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## hsmomof4 (Oct 31, 2008)

That is all great info. Could it be put in 101?


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## stoneyheightsfarm (Jan 19, 2008)

We plan on going on test this year. I was aching over the hassle of Standard w/my already very full life, but ADGA now allowing Owner Sampler options to be eligible for Advanced Registry with one verification test makes that a very good deal. I found that the TN DHIA wasn't as helpful or affordable as going through Langston, also. So, you can check with various testing centers and see which will work best for you. Langston sent me tests to get certified as a tester, a DVD on how to fill out all the paperwork, the herd forms, and a box of vials (with preservative pills) FREE. They said I could call with any questions and were very kind and helpful. Now to go through all the ADGA paperwork and buy my scale!

As a tag on-- where is the best place to get my scale? I want one that measures in tenths so I don't have to do so much math. 

Oh, and another reason to do it? If you sell milk shares, it is one more piece of information you can give your shareholders, giving them a greater sense of ownership and confidence in your herd and the milk they are drinking!


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## Aja-Sammati (Oct 26, 2007)

Yes! If you are doing milk shares, it also gives you SCC, which can help make your milk 'safer'. Your scale MUST have 10ths to be used for test. Caprine, Hoeggers & even Jeffers(sometimes) sell a Palouze hanging scale for about $40. It measures in 10ths. You have to have it certified once a year at your county, or some associations offer certs. CA DHIA does them for $25 which includes return postage, but I do mine at the county weights and measures office. Since it isn't for trade they usually do it for free. I do know one herd that uses a digital scale. It measures in tenths also, and they get it certed at the county. They just tare out the bucket weight before pouring in the milk.

The ADGA paperwork is really simple, if you are doing owner/sampler for AR you just have to make sure you have a letter from your association confirming that you did tester training to send in to ADGA with your application.

I know I am a DRPC (Data Records Processing Center) snob- I love Provo since they have so many useful forms for herd and records management. It can be hard locally though, and I am glad to hear that you were able to get in touch with Langston. One reason why some associations don't want to work with goat herds is that cow dairies are almost all digital now and goat people still send in everything handwritten... our stuff takes more manpower to do.

Maybe the notes I am still typing up on using genetic evals as tools would be good for 101...maybe not my encouragement to get genetic tools :lol I have been passionate about DHIR & appraisal since before I started using them, since I could see what they could do for a breeding program- when programs get updated/made easier, I like to encourage everyone to take another look at them  It can take time to hook into the system to get training, etc., so if you are considering DHIR in the future, it is never too early to contact an association about tester training, etc.


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## 2Sticks (Dec 13, 2007)

I love DHIR and am so glad we decided last year to go on it. I bought some new digital scales off ebay and sent them in to Langston along with $10. for return postage. Got them back about a week later. It's such a great program, and my first year on DHIR & Linear Apprasial one doe earned her *M and another SG. I think they are both very important programs and am looking forward to to participating in both again this year.



Tamera


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## Ziggy (Nov 13, 2009)

We plan to be on starting this year. Have competed the training and have to send in paperwork. 

Trying to decide between Langston or Dairy One. Was planning on using Langston but it looks like most people in NC are using Dairy One.


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## Jacquelynn (Dec 2, 2008)

We are starting our herd this year. Just getting going but I am really excited about it. Waiting on my packet from ADGA.
Jacquelynn


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## Patty13637 (Oct 26, 2007)

Have paperwork in hand and half filled out.

Patty


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## luvzmybabz (Sep 15, 2008)

I have looked into it a bit but have not done the serious sit down and read everything then print everything to reread and catch everything I miss type research. Sadly enough there are not many goat people here in OK that really seem to care about testing, it woud really just be for my own herd use (my knowledge not really making a difference on the$ of animals sold). I have thought about it and in my world just not something I can pull off this year but hopefully can get started next year on it, Just another ? to talk to Langston about (I will be visiting them at least twice in the spring for workshops, so glad that they are very close about 1 hour by turnpike) I have spent hours on their website, learning all kids of things. 

For someone on DHIR how much extra time per day do you think that you spend on the testing part of your chores? and what is the process for the verification does someone just come out with a scale and make sure everything is matching up?

With a VERY small herd, that will have to stay small due to acreage how feasible is it cost wise since you OP has 20 does on test then the cost of verification is spread out over the amount of does but say you have 5 does on test thenm is it really price effective, since it will primarily be for my own use and I do not feel that it would effect the price of animals sold from my herd? (I could be wrong) but many here in OK are backyard breeders/milkers that do not seem to care about appraisal milk testing or even disease testing (my big peeve).

Thanks for anyones input!


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## nightskyfarm (Sep 7, 2009)

I milk on a pipeline. Where can I find 3 Wakaito or Tru-test meters for a reasonable price. I can not milk my 37 by hand on test day, I have arthritis so after one or two does it's pretty unbearable. I want to be in DHIR, but the VA DHIA has not been helpful, They will come meter, but they can not do the lab work. Their equipment is only set up to do cow milk samples. Can your samples go out to any lab for testing? Jennifer


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## Sondra (Oct 25, 2007)

testing day is a little longer especially if you milk by machine. 
and depending on how many goats you have.
the test and schooling for becoming a tester is very easy so do it.


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## stoneyheightsfarm (Jan 19, 2008)

Jennifer, I plan on using Langston in OK as opposed to TN DHIA in Knoxville, even though I live in TN. I think you can just call the lab and check. Langston told me they do milk testing for goats all over the world even!

Kasi, you don't test every day, only once a month. They average everything out from the test day results. If you do owner/sampler, you use your own scale and have to have it calibrated once a year. You don't have to do a verification test, but if you want your girls to earn milk stars, or in combination with Linear Appraisal to be eligible for SG, then you need a VT. 

I think you just have to look at what it will take to test, what it will cost you, and determine for yourself if the results/benefits are worth the extra time and expense to you. Not everyone is going to do it, and that's okay. However, I think it's worth serious consideration.


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## Aja-Sammati (Oct 26, 2007)

Yes, you only have test one day a month (between 25-45 days apart). It takes me about a minute per doe to fill out the paperwork in the spring and fall when I have to record fresh, breeding & dry dates. If you just want to know your components, etc. then a good option might be to do periodic testing throughout the year. Both owner/sampler programs require VT, and it is through these programs that we gain the most insight into how are does produce and what our bucks are doing. One sample to test components durint eh year will not give you an accurate picture, as compnents vary throughout the year, and even between am & pm milkings.



> Their equipment is only set up to do cow milk samples.


All equipment that is set up to do cow samples can run goat samples- so they just don't want to do goat tests. Just wanted you to know they are uhm, being less than truthful.


> I milk on a pipeline.


This is a harder problem! I know people that milk 4 at a time into a bucket on their machine, on test day they do one at a time, dump & weigh the milk, continue, but with pipeline you will really need meters. I would suggest to finds cow dairies going out of business and score some. Our DHIA sells tham for only $189, which is way cheaper than the over $200 brand new price. They also calibrate them, but you have to ship them max 2 to a box, bubble wrapped like there is no tomorrow. Since you are actually running a cheese production, test would be especially valuable to you. Maybe you can plan on buying meters this year, and then going on test next year?


> With a VERY small herd, that will have to stay small due to acreage how feasible


It would depend on how much you would use the data and how much you would pay for verification. My verification tester works for gas money and soap. When I started on test I was milking 9, I will freshen 36 this year, but will only keep 20. Janet Cooper (uses Langston) has 8-9 on test and pays around $20 per month- that includes her shipping, plus the ADGA fees. She said her fees are "$8.00 plus .08 per doe, then 1.15 for each sample" You won't have samples for does a couple months of the year, when they are dry, but you always have to send in paperwork each month. For does, through Langston, it would cost you about $24 a month (that includes your ADGA fees), if you can barter with your verification tester.

Part of how DHIR works for you depends on how you want to do marketing. Some people only want to sell family milkers, they never want to sell seed stock to a dairy, they aren't going to put the effort into raising show quality or breeding stock. That is fine! I think though, that if you want to command top dollar for your stock, in a market that is going to get more competitive, that you need to have numbers to back up your prices. It takes education to get people to understand health issues, and it takes education to show how a doe with good scores on appraisal & milk test costs less money to care for while producing more... that saves money. Like Vicki says- it costs just as much to feed a bad doe as to feed a good one. Everyone likes to save money


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