# Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions? (Solved!)



## AlaynaMay (May 12, 2012)

So my Am. Nubian doe, Mabel, has had a hard lump or knot in her left teat for quite some time (about a year, maybe a little more). I noticed that one teat was harder to milk out than the other, and it gradually grew larger and harder until it became virtually impossible to milk out. So we dried off that side. There is a very distinct lump or knot about half-way down the teat. I'm guessing that it's about the size of an airsoft BB (slightly larger than a regular BB.) I'm thinking that maybe it's a fat deposit as the person I bought her from was feeding a very high protein pelleted feed. I've massaged it for a while, first carefully washing and soaking in warm water, and was able to get some pretty good squirts of liquid out, but in a day or two it was right back to its previous condition. She's due to kid in December, so I'm a little concerned about it. Any ideas for how to get rid of this? I prefer natural treatments, and have read a lot about natural health care (for animals and people), but never came across this before.
Thank you for your advice!
Alayna


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## Ashley (Oct 25, 2007)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

There was someone a while back asking about this but I can't find the thread darn it. As I recall, the knot in her doe's teat was able to be moved around, like you could push it up the teat and milk would come out and it would make it's way back to the bottom and clog it again. Does it seem to be moveable like that or more something that is part of the flesh? Is it rubbery or more like a rock? In her case, she actually managed to work it right out the teat orifice. It was very difficult and the orifice had to stretch a lot but she got it out and it healed up fine.


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## swgoats (May 21, 2010)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

One of my does was getting plugs when I fed her calf manna. One was so bad I barely got it out. I used a sterile needle (for giving injections) to very carefully break it up, and then forced the pieces out. I hesitate to recommend that, cause it is possible to damage the teat. I think vets have a little instrument they can use. After I got the plugs out, I dipped the teat in straight Hibiclens and let it dry on the teat. I quit feeding the calf manna, and she was fine. The plugs were like curds. Kind of rubbery.

Is the doe CAE negative?


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## AlaynaMay (May 12, 2012)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

I tried working it out the orifice, and it did seem to loosen up (that's when I was able to squeeze liquid out), but it didn't move around, though it did seem to sort of break up.

She was fed Calf Manna before shows at her other home, in addition to 16% pellets, so I don't know if that could be the problem.

I haven't yet tested her for CAE, but she has shown zero symptoms of it that I can see, so I hope she's negative. But I know that this can be dormant for a while, so am planning to test her at some point after she kids.


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## fmg (Jul 4, 2011)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

I would suggest testing before she kids for CAE, so that if she does come up positive, you will be able to salvage the kids (by removing them immediately and raising them on prevention). CAE is a sneaky disease and a huge portion of positive goats don't show any symptoms.


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## Island Creek Farm (Jun 16, 2010)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

Calcium deposit ? I have a doe that gets a clump every now and then, but she has had an udder injury at some point (dog), vets say it's from that as her milk tests clean. Couldn't hurt to check for sub clinical mastitis


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## AlaynaMay (May 12, 2012)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

I've read that a pregnant doe will test negative even if she has it... is this true? (That's why I was holding off.)


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## dragonlair (Mar 24, 2009)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

It could be scar tissue too. We had that problem with a couple of cows we had. Had to use an instrument (I forgot what its called) that you insert into the canal and then pull it back out. It has a sharp hook thing that only cuts when you withdraw it. Usually after you use it, you have to insert a plastic cannula until it's healed.


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## Ober House (Jul 12, 2012)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

I had a doe like that and I took her to the vet for her blood work and she said lots of goats get them. Then her blood work came back positive for CL and not CAE She was put down. I am a firm believer of testing everyone in my herd.


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## swgoats (May 21, 2010)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

I bought a CAE positive doe right before I started testing. She freshened with what felt like a plug. It never could be milked out even after the vet ran the thing up the teat. He thought that it was mastitis and the half was full of scar tissue. But when I tested her she was positive. I don't believe it had anything to do with mastitis. I had to put her down, and her kids since I hadn't tested in advance or pulled the kids. I've never heard that you couldn't test them pregnant.


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## smithurmonds (Jan 20, 2011)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

How could that be true, when we all send in samples for pregnancy testing at the same time as CAE?


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## Ober House (Jul 12, 2012)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

I just tested for CAE and CL and now I am doing pregnancy testing in a week. Next year I will do them together. I test new goats coming in. I like the thought of being able to do them together, much less stress.

As for my girls lump I massaged it and since she was precocious I milked her once a week ans she always had hard clumps so those became less with weekly milking instead of every 3 to 4 weeks. The lump was the size of a golf ball after a while. The odd thing was she never has any abscesses, Thank God, and her titer was low. they said she could have been vaccinated. I was not willing to bet the rest of my heard on it so I chose to put her down. The rest of my herd is neg/neg.

I pray you have much better results than I did. but I was told not to worry about it as lumps were common in precocious does.


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## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*



AlaynaMay said:


> I've read that a pregnant doe will test negative even if she has it... is this true? (That's why I was holding off.)


You "read that", as in, from a published paper or you "read that" on some foo-foo forum? Sorry, don't mean to be unfriendly, but if you read here, do a search on CAE and read the threads, yes, thread after thread, it will take days or weeks, but you will get an education and a real knowledge of CAE and it's symptoms, testing protocols and heartbreak.

TEST YOUR DOES! TEST YOUR INCOMING STOCK!!!

Just because a doe is asymptomatic DOES NOT MEAN that she is not CAE+. That's kind of like looking at someone and being able to tell if they are HIV+ or have cancer.

A doe with a CAE udder is ROCK HARD. No lumps, no nothing. Like trying to squeeze blood from a stone. Maybe a couple of squirts, but even they take effort.

CL tests are very unreliable. I had my first two goats tested. Negative. But something I picked up on here that Vicki said at one point (ok, probably more than once) is that stress will bring out CL and the stress of kidding could surely bring that out. So after testing my first two does for CL, I've decided against testing for that because of the inaccuracy of the test, but I do watch my herd all the time.

So back to the OP. I have a doe with a hard knot in her udder, near the teat, where the udder meets the teat. She does not have any clumps or strings or off-colored milk, nor does she have gel on CMT. I have sent her milk off for testing and it has been negative. I finally brought her to the vet to see what he thought, and he came up with nothing based on milk tests, etc. The only way we would really know is to take it out, but then you open that up (literally) to so many other issues that we (collectively) decided to leave it alone. It does not inhibit milk flow or quality.

Just my two cents (and some from experience).


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## AlaynaMay (May 12, 2012)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

Thank you very much! I will test her ASAP, and my other two does too. The lump/knot is actually in the teat, about half-way down. I forgot to mention that one teat (the one with the lump) is smaller than the other, with is slightly bulbous and soft. Could this cause a problem? The rest of her udder is fine, milks out great, not hard or anything like that.


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## doublebowgoats (Mar 6, 2008)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

Filling with milk is what encourages the teat and udder to enlarge and develop capacity so it could be that the side with the knot has not been able to develop as much as the other side, since it is hard to get the milk out.


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## AlaynaMay (May 12, 2012)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

So I'm having the same problem with this knot/ lump in Mabel's teat again. It had loosened up a lot right before she kidded, but now I can't get any milk out of it at all. I called the very last night, but haven't heard back from her yet. Any suggestions as to what I can do?


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## lorit (May 10, 2010)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

Did you ever test for CAE? Results? When did she freshen?


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## AlaynaMay (May 12, 2012)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

Tested for CAE this week- she's negative as of Tuesday. She freshened very early Wednesday morning.


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## Qadosh Adamah Lamanchas (Nov 2, 2012)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

Could it be a clogged/swollen milk gland/duct?


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## AlaynaMay (May 12, 2012)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

It feels like the canal is clogged. I got about two drops out this afternoon, but that's it. She's getting really tight. I'm going to keep massaging it, and try to get a vet out here tomorrow, or do something myself.


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## fmg (Jul 4, 2011)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

I wonder if there is some kind of scar tissue in her streak canal??


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## AlaynaMay (May 12, 2012)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

I don't know. She didn't have the knot when I first got her, but developed it about six months later. It grew slowly. One thing we noticed was that it wasn't as bad when we exercised her more (ran her around the perimeter of our property daily), but that got to just be too much to handle. Maybe we should go back to it though- it would give us our exercise too.


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## AlaynaMay (May 12, 2012)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

I tried to break it up with a needle last night since I can't seem to get hold of the vet. The needles I had were too short, so I used a teeny tiny (well sterilized) crochet hook. I got to the knot, and if feels like a very hard deposit of some kind- calcium maybe? I don't know, but it didn't feel soft or rubbery, so I don't think it's a fat deposit or scar tissue. How should I deal with this?


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## Qadosh Adamah Lamanchas (Nov 2, 2012)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

I know that calcium deposits in humans are caused by injury, aging, or dramatic flux in hormones. They're normally benign and disappear on their own. I don't know if that translates to caprines


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## AlaynaMay (May 12, 2012)

*Re: Hard knot in teat- Any suggestions?*

Well, the vet came out yesterday, and she was able to take care of it. :woohoo She had some little tool (I think she called it an udder knife!) that she used to cut through the obstruction. She said she thought it was scar tissue, not a normal tumor or knot that they sometimes get. She said that if the surgery hadn't worked Mabel would have had to lose that half of her udder. I am so very thankful that she got it (and so is Mabel- it must feel amazingly good to get that pressure off)!
I am so relieved! (Actually I fainted, which is very rare for me- I think I would have been fine if I had been the one doing it. I held her leg while the vet performed the surgery, and I was fine until a minute after she was done. I think it was the relief as much as anything else. Blood and grossness doesn't usually bother me too much. My 9 year old sister was fine through the whole thing, and has been teasing me ever since. :/)


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## Ashley (Oct 25, 2007)

Heehee, I would tease you too  Congrats on getting it fixed! That would be a big relief!


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## doublebowgoats (Mar 6, 2008)

So glad you got it fixed!


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