# Tails



## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

Having no experience with kids, do all kid's tails curve over the back or do mine just not have good conformation? They are alpines.


----------



## Bernice (Apr 2, 2009)

Ya know Cindy I have raised goats for over 20 yrs and most of them with Alpines. This is going to sound so bad......but I can't ever recall noticing their tails curving over their backs. I'm sure they did, but I don't recall thinking anything strange about it. I don't think either that it's related to bad confirmation. It'll be interesting to see what others say.


----------



## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

A true rye tail, is a fault and it's genetic, perhaps a photo is up somewhere if you google it. But as many of my does carry their tail up as straight out, normally leaving curled back over the rump for the 24hours before kidding when they loose controlof their tails due to the loosening of their ligiments (thurls) to kid. Vicki


----------



## Bernice (Apr 2, 2009)

Cindy...I forgot to ask you how old the kids were and if their tails look like a piggy tail curled over. I also forgot to mention that if mine did, they didn't stay that way all the time. 

Well...dag Vicki......I just learned something new after all my yrs, rye tail.


----------



## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

I know that is how you say it, rye tail, don't know if that is how you spell it....someone google and post a photo for us! Vicki


----------



## Bernice (Apr 2, 2009)

I've got google up in another window so I will. I was looking up pescatarian as some mentioned, had no idea what that was.

Can't find it, did see a pic of a white tail deer but it was about white tail deer. Hmmmm....any ideas how to spell that one?


----------



## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

Bernice- it is a vegetarian who occasionally eats fish!
Pesca...pescador...pescadore etc..


Wry tail as in Awry


----------



## Bernice (Apr 2, 2009)

AHA!!!!! Thanks Lee!  OK, here I go again!


----------



## Bernice (Apr 2, 2009)

Well Dag........this one is hard and I usually can nail a search fast. I bet Sondra can find a picture, she has the, "knack!"

I couldn't find anything on a google image or yahooie image search with the new spelling. Hmmmm.....

Here is a website I found, an exerpt from a book: 
http://books.google.com/books?id=Z9NCAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA176&lpg=PA176&dq=wry+tail+in+animals&source=bl&ots=Pz5UJ90Win&sig=q0d1GGEaRqO0z3SrKQnNbIMgRN0#v=onepage&q=wry%20tail%20in%20animals&f=false

http://jhered.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/pdf_extract/27/7/269

http://forums.ablackhorse.com/lofiversion/index.php?t14628.html


----------



## Laverne (Apr 4, 2010)

I've noticed that a lot of Nigie's around here have wry tail, including my buck. I've wondered if it could be nutritional. He has a bad permanent fishtail and and wry tail. Copper deficiency?


----------



## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

"A congenital abnormality like wry nose is not usually considered genetic."

"Congenital disorders can be a result of genetic abnormalities, the intrauterine environment, or unknown factors."

I must not know the difference between Congenital and Genetic...anyone care to "splain" to me  Vicki


----------



## LMonty (Oct 25, 2007)

congenital is existing at birth, genetic is something caused by genes. an example- there could be a difficult birth that causes injury or brain damage, thats congenital. other in the womb damage or problems are the same- like a calf that might be a genetic female, but due to the hormones from her twin brother she doesnt develop her female sexual organs completely and ends up with an incomplete female genital tract. that's a congential defect, but not genetic. injury, chemical or grug damage, etc are more likel;y to be congentical problems and the things that are actually caused by the genes themselves- gender, G6S, hair/eye color, etc, those are genetic.


----------



## Jo~* (Oct 26, 2007)

Well in Chickens a wry tail goes off sideways, squirrel tail goes over the back kind of and split tail is just that a split tail.
JoAnn


----------



## Laverne (Apr 4, 2010)

my buck has a wry squirrel with a twist plus a fishtail. Look at the 4th buck down, Illusion, good example. The 5th buck down is my bucks dad Final Stand. Lots of fishtails on this page. My bucks tail got worse when he was in full rut. It's like everything on him constricted. His eyes bugged, hair stood on end and tail tightened up even more. Making him very attractive to the girls.

http://www.camanna.com/reference_bucks.htm


----------



## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

I'll try to get a pic. Doesn't seem necessarily abnormal at this time, I guess. I don't know. I just happened to notice it yesterday.


----------



## LLB101 (Sep 29, 2009)

Laverne said:


> my buck has a wry squirrel with a twist plus a fishtail... The 5th buck down is my bucks dad Final Stand... http://www.camanna.com/reference_bucks.htm


Nice site!

Couple things, some say the fishtail is a low copper sign?

You're in Portland and are allowed to have a buck?


----------



## Laverne (Apr 4, 2010)

Fish tail with a bald tip on the tail is copper deficiency. I bought him with the problem and it will be permanent, although the bald area is sprouting some hair since his copper intake. I have to say that the gal at Camanna got him and his mom back from a sale, so she didn't raise him from the start, so no copper in his diet early on. The bottom of his scrotum is bald also, don't know if it is copper related there also. 
I havn't seen anything about not keeping bucks in Portland but it wouldn't be good for someone without much space. I have him situated in the middle of the property. He is small so less smell. In the winter , the rut time, with all the rain and cold the smell is muted. He is a couple hundred feet from any neighbor. We get the columbia gorge winds a lot here so the smell is dissipated. Nobody knows I have a buck. A guy called from the city just asking what livestock I had. I said 3 full size goats and one nigerian. He didn't ask if I had a buck. My neighbors have had a buck for 10 years. I am in the outskirts of Portland and it used to be county so I'm grandfathered in. But If there is ever an issue with a neighbor being bothered with him I would be considerate.


----------



## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

Why is a deficiency permanent? Do you know that he is genetically incapable of assimilating copper? I think you should look at zinc and other minerals as well. There is more to skin and hair than copper. How much oil is in his diet? You can add some high quality seed oil or wheat germ oil as top dressing and increase coat and skin health. Fish tail is not incurable since it is a dietary problem. He can pick up some copper or would have died by now. Do you have a vet that can get you some Mineral Max2? It is injectable and an immediate mineral supplement. The zinc level is very high and I have seen some pretty nasty stuff turn around with using it.


----------



## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

I know for my doe Shoofly, she came with a bald tail tip as a 2 year old and although she is bolused, now going on 5 years? she never did grow back any hair on her tip, perhaps she was bald too long? The hair on the sides is fine now, but if you part it back she is bald. Vick


----------



## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

So maybe it is a genetic thing like rat tail in Appaloosas?
Not dietary beyond a certain point but just the kind of hair and skin.


----------



## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Someone else brought that up also Lee. I think that if the tail is bald for long enough, they never grow back all the way, least ways that was how it was for me. I don't have any of her daughters and sons that are grown here, but do have grandaughters and great granddaughters, and a daughter out of her son  they all have normal tails........but perhaps like you said once they loose it they won't grow it back on the tip due to the skin? No idea  Vicki


----------

