# Copper Bolus - Technique Question



## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

Hi.

I've read all I can about copper bolusing and felt quite comfortable taking apart the boluses, weighing and repackaging into the gel caps. I then put a little peanut butter in a calf balling gun so that the capsules would stick. Stuck it at the back of their throats and plunged. Unfortunately, they were able to get them up and spit them out. Maybe it's obvious, but should I have put the end down their throat farther? 

There's got to be an easier way.

Please let me know how you get the pills down. Thanks.


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## Kris (Mar 28, 2010)

I read somewhere on here that Vicki said she placed it far enough back to make them gag. I can't recall where I read that. I'll have to search to find that.


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## KittyFL (Mar 31, 2009)

I tried peanut butter but I think it was too sticky so I switched to probios which is a little more slippery and had no problems. Maybe if you taught them peanut butter is a treat by giving them a little on crackers, then they would gobble it down. That was going to be my next step if the probios hadn't worked.

Kitty


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## Sondra (Oct 25, 2007)

I use nothing to make it stick in the gun but you have to get it far enough back in the throat so they swallow it.


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## luvzmybabz (Sep 15, 2008)

my husband tried to use to balling gun however after 2 goats he just got the bolus opened stuck in the far back enough to make them start to gag and then held their mouth shut with one hand and massaged the throat until they swallowed I told him to do it a couple of times because I wanted to make sure it did not come back up. Now me I will not stick my hands in a goats mouth but hubby is braver then I am that way!!


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## Dana (Dec 7, 2009)

I have used the balling gun and I have used my fingers to stick in the back of their throats, with about the same results. I can feel in there better with my fingers. 

The biggest thing that helped me was holding their mouth closed and keeping their heads up and gently rubbing their throats until I heard or felt them swallow!


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

I don't use a balling gun, I use a pill gun for dogs and cats. I have to use peanut butter to stick the capsule to the pill gun because I do it by myself one handed  If they got it from their throat to their tongue to chew it you didn't get it into their throat you put it on the back of their tongue. Feel how far back that tongue is in the mouth, you have to put it in their throat. Vicki


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## MiaBella Farm (Jul 22, 2008)

I recently attended a workshop where we talked about proper copper bolusing and they told us SPECIFICALLY to NOT hold the goats head UP, but rather hold the head level. Make sure the pill is as far back on the tongue as possible, then close their mouth and hold the head level until they swallow.

By holding their head UP you risk choking and/or inhaling of the pill.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Yes Michelle because they are using a balling gun  A pill gun is about 9 inches long and is made out of flexible plastic, a balling gun is about a foot and a half long and made out of PVC pipe. Vicki


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## MiaBella Farm (Jul 22, 2008)

We don't use the long baling gun, we use a short pill gun. I could not imagine trying to use the long one... :crazy If I was a goat, I don't think that would be too inviting! eek!

Troy puts the goat on the milkstand and in goes the pill...then Troy holds the mouth shut...he actually does this whole process himself.


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## deJardine (Apr 29, 2009)

I just had the pleasure of Bolusing my girls all by myself... I ordered the blue piller from Jeffers and it seemed like it was too large. It did not even hold the pills securely and I think I was doing something wrong.

It was a challenge but I got 'er done. I may try using the drenching gun with some liquid and the adapter attached on the end... or use a marshmallow. Has anyone tried that?


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## Feral Nature (Oct 26, 2007)

I have the occasional girl crunch a copper blous like it is candy. I assume that they still get some benefits from the rods as they ingest them, do I have to re-bolus them right away? I have been, but it would be less pricey to not have to.


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## Ozark Lady (Mar 21, 2010)

I understand that they need copper, but isn't there some way to smash up the bolus, sprinkle it over food and convince them to simply eat it?
I hate giving animals pills!


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## buckrun (Mar 7, 2008)

No-do not use fluid and do not let them chew it- it is designed to lodge in the lining of the abomasum and should not be ingested with food or liquid. You will risk aspiration into the lungs. And that is somewhere you do not want to go!
It is so simple really. Stand next to the goat facing the same way the goat faces. 
Reach your arm around so you are pinning their neck to your hip and grab the bottom jaw with your thumb on one side and fingers on the other. Take the hand with the bolus gun in the fingers and use the flat side of your hand to open the top part of the mouth. Rotate the fingers around and put the gun down the throat OVER and past the hump in the tongue at back and eject.
It takes lots longer to tell how to do it than to do it once you get a system. I don't even tie mine up. They never know what hit em. Of course they love the smell of the almond butter on the tip and they actually come looking for more when we are done. You must get the intact capsule down past the grinding teeth for it to work properly. If you can worm you can bolus. It's all in your attitude. Just don't take no for an answer.
There are many ways to use your body and a fence or wall to gain complete control of even the most recalcitrant animal so learn what works for holding them before you start to give them the bolus so you don't waste it. Most people use the milkstand but I find it far too much trouble to put them up there climb up there to be able to hold the head in place since they will thrash around in there more than when they are loose. Then they associate the milk stand with nasty things happening so I only milk on the milk stand. I do meds and other stuff on the ground.
Just tell yourself it is so easy cuz it is! Then your goat will believe you that is it no big deal and you will come to an amiable agreement and down it goes. Our feed store has lots of sizes for bolus guns. They have a little brown one that is the size for goats and it is like 1.oo and just the right size. Check with your feed store and don't spend much on them. Some people use pill pushers from the pet store as well. 
Lee


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## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

Well, I know the rods are supposed to go directly to their stomach and lodged in there somewhere. Kind of like a slow-release pill. So they are not supposed to chew them.

I too bought the blue balling gun from Jeffers. AND I had my hand in their mouths AND my husband was holding the goats.

I agree...it must be easier with another "tool". I, too, would be interested to know if anyone drenched with the attached adaptor. It certainly sounds easier.


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## Feral Nature (Oct 26, 2007)

I use the red rubber gun or whatever you call it. it works fine. I use probios to stick to the bolus. And I use the shock and awe method with the goats, they don't see me coming and when they do it's all over.


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## linuxboy (Oct 26, 2009)

The reason we use copper oxide needles is for the slow release. And the reason we pack them into a cap and try to get the cap to reach the rumen in tact, or relatively in tact as one bundle is to ensure that the needles stay and not just pass through. What happens with an in tact cap is that it will lodge in a part of the rumen, and then as it dissolves, the copper needles settle to the rumen folds, because they are heavy. For them to settle, they need to be in touch with the surface wall of the rumen. If not, they will get mixed up in all the contents, although some will still get caught in the folds. From there, the needles move from the rumen a little at a time to the recticulum, omasum, and then the abomasum. This moving process lasts up to a year, maybe even more, for a properly administered gel cap. Copper oxide is rather stable. For it to go into ionic form (required for absorption) takes time. 

If you just add it by mixing in with some banana, or if they chew it, it's not the end of the world, but more will just be pooped out right away. It's hard to say how much will be retained in the rumen. And in that, your copper program becomes less consistent than the same program of someone who administers a gel cap that makes it down in tact. Yet, it should provide enough slow release copper for at least a few months.


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## MF-Alpines (Mar 29, 2010)

Thanks, Lee. We must have been posting at the same time.

I tried to tell this to my husband last night, but he wanted to give up. I finally gave into HIM. Next time, I'll trust myself, take a breath, and just do it!

I only got 2 grams down each goat (that's all my gel caps would hold). Maybe a stupid question, but should I try again? I understand the dosages.


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