# Old milk, highest use



## LLB101 (Sep 29, 2009)

Ok, my life's been a bit overwhelming lately, and I have a backlog of milk that I didn't have time to make cheese with. Its a shame. Really. I spend so much on organic feed and it really gets me when I can't keep on top of everything. But I can't lately. I've even given up lots of micromanaging :biggrin

Anyway, I have 3 categories of "old" milk to decide its highest and best use. 

Minorly yucky, in refridg a month-ish, separated into whey and varying textures of cheesy coagulant solids, some of which actually smells kind of good in a strong cheese kind of way. Some of the coagulated stuff is very smooth and creamy like gorgeous silky custard, others are chunky and very solid. (OT: I want a lab to know what's in this stuff! ) 

Then there's some that's more yucky, either bubbly and/or a bit of dark honey colored slime on top, smells not so great, there's the least amount of this, maybe only 20% and if burying it in compost is the highest use, I'm ok with that. 

Third is some I stuck the jars in the freezer, but not right away, when I thaw those, they have fluffy solids and whey-ish liquid but very different from normal whey or the natural whey-ish liquid in the minorly yucky stuff. Tastes like awful powdered milk, ugh!

I keep remembering, maybe wrongly, fragments from here about ANY milk, no matter how yucky, still makes decent soap, as its just the chemical reaction and all the rest gets burned off by the lye, am I in the ballpark? I have a lifetime supply of soap milk if that's the case, I'd better take to soap making and like it, LOL!

If I had pigs, a lot of the cheesy stuff is still probably good enough, but I don't have pigs. And friends with pigs that I've given old milk to before, its a risky mess to haul and I just don't feel like it right now. Maybe one of you will convince me that's the highest and best use.

I've read things about how milk benefits pastures, tried some on my lawn, didn't see big effects and question how much I could really use if that's it highest value. I have to think skim milk would be a whole lot better for plants than this high BF whole stuff! DHIA tests are 8-11% BF lately.

With that BF% is soap its best use? 

Do I only need the solid, creamy part? And the wheyish part, does it really do anything in soap? 

If its just liquid, or offers some minor minerals or whatever for soap benefits, should I put it in blender before freezing it flat for soap, since its seems like the chunky and whey would be very hard to measure correctly as "milk" ?

I'd like multiple opinons if you have one you think might be in the minority  cuz you might say some reason that speaks to something I didn't think to include here. :biggrin

Thanks everyone!

All the best,
Lacia Lynne


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

I just take a whisk and whisk it all back into yogurt, and pour. I use everything but Corid milk.

Since some of your milk will be solids, just don't discount your liquid. So if you are using 16 ounces of lye melt it into 32 ounces of milk with solids in it. Yes it will take longer to cure.

I don't soap mold, but old seperated yogurt, lambar milk, whey, all goes into my soap. Vicki


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## LLB101 (Sep 29, 2009)

Oh, mold... only 2 had a bit (pencil eraser to half a dime size) of dark green mold. I took that out already with some of the milk solids it was sitting on. Hasn't grown back in another week-ish.

By "whey" you mean cheese whey? What function does it serve in soaping, is it just liquid or something more?


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## adillenal (Feb 6, 2009)

I personally think soap made with sour goat milk is divine.


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## LLB101 (Sep 29, 2009)

adillenal said:


> ...soap made with sour goat milk is divine.


Ok, great, LOL at label with marketing "spin" making it a feature... "live cultured" goat milk? LOL

So do you blend up the solids/whey or use it chunky or just use the creamy solids?


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## tmfinley (Feb 21, 2008)

For me it would depend on how big n chunky it is. I have used separated slightly chunky milk but the chunks weren't huge. You are probably going to be using a stick blender anyway which will pulverize any chunks anyway.


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## LLB101 (Sep 29, 2009)

Good point about stick blending... My question is more about measuring. Vicki suggested whisking which makes sense, but I'm curious if the whey part serves any real function other than just to be liquid, and the benefit is really in the chunky, creamy part.

Some of the chunky is floating, bite sized chucks, some is a solid creamy slab. Anyone know what makes the difference? Obviously different bacteria, but anyone know which do what?


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Your under the impression we add goatmilk for benefits  :rofl :biggrin Na, I know it effects PH and also adds butterfat, but in reality it's label appeal. I simply add my cheese whey to the milk bucket, so it isn't actually only whey in the soap. No bacteria is going to make it through the lye, saponification is a complete chemical reaction it doesn't pick and choose what liquids/butters and oils, it is going to turn into soap. Vicki


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## LLB101 (Sep 29, 2009)

Righto! I've heard you on that primary benefit is on the label... but but but... Just hard to believe it would be so popular with no detectable benefit... it might be true, I can think of other examples where humans are so convinced something is true that flies in the face of all evidence. 

So, everyone SAYS the soap is "nicer" with the goatmilk... is it really just expectation? If you make a batch with water, and the otherwise same batch with goatmilk, is there a detectable difference if you didn't know which is which?


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## hsmomof4 (Oct 31, 2008)

No, it's nicer.  Seriously. I got some excellent handmade soap from someone, lathers beautifully, smells great, really nice soap. Stuck it in the shower. A few days later, hubby says, "I need you to get me a bar of your soap for in here, this stuff is drying me out." I have tried lots of different handmade soaps and I can tell the ones with GM. But interestingly, I'm involved in a swap over on The Dish where everyone is making the exact same recipe but just changing up a few additives to see how they affect lather, etc. It will be interesting to see how it goes. So one person is using all aloe vera juice for the liquid, another is using goat milk, another, coconut milk. I'm using yogurt for part of the liquid, someone is adding sugar, another person, honey, etc. There are like 22 or 23 different variations we are testing.


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## LLB101 (Sep 29, 2009)

Super cool, I hope you post the results! Or do you need more testers?


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## Faye Farms (Sep 14, 2009)

I don't think it's just label appeal. Milk soaps are better. Stacey, I hope you post some results too. Especially if one soap really sticks out over the others. I haven't done any sort of playing around with different/new ingredients ins quite some time.


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## hsmomof4 (Oct 31, 2008)

I will share the results when they are in. It will be a while. We don't even mail our soaps to the swap coordinator for over a month, and then we have to test them all.


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## tlcnubians (Jan 21, 2011)

I've never used old or soured milk in my soaps but now I'm going to have to give it a try! 

Stacey - remember when you're testing those soaps that the way they behave is often dependant on the type of water you have . . . 

Caroline


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

This sounds like an excellent soap swap! Everyone could make two identical recipes, colors, textures, scent, everything.....wrapped and marked only with your name and A and B, we could send soap to non soapers on the forum and have them guess which one contains the 100% goatmilk and the one that is water??? They can guess on the forum and we can verify it by ahead of time you telling only the person in charge of the swap which one is the water and which is the soap. We can ask for non-soapers over in Off Topic so we don't get any new folks who won't play along after they say they will. 

I think everyone should use a scent that discolors to tan so that it isn't obviously a 100% milkbar, like OMH. In fact does everyone want to just do OMH?

I get Lacia!!! 
Right off the top we could use, Lindsey, Daniel, Tracy, Christine, Lee, etc.

Whose game? Vicki


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## Guest (Jan 6, 2012)

I am Vicki, 
Barb


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## hsmomof4 (Oct 31, 2008)

Yes, Caroline, but with 18 different people testing soaps, I imagine we will still get a pretty good idea of what makes a difference and what doesn't. For example, if nearly everyone finds that adding ingredient X leaves you with a soap that no one can distinguish from the control in terms of lather or anything else, it's probably safe to conclude that that particular additive is not worth doing. And if nearly everyone finds that additive Y makes the very best soap of the bunch, it's probably a good one to include.

And I'm game for another swap, Vicki!  (And I have OMH, too.) Are we just going to use whatever recipe we want for the soap itself? Walmart recipe? All veggie recipe? (The one we did for this other swap is 50% olive, 25% palm, 25% coconut.)


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

Yes any recipe, just as long as the two scents (if you make a plain OMH with no scent make sure your goatmilk does not color you soap beige and you water soap is white, it wouldn't be fair), colors, additives, recipes are identical in both bars....the only difference will be that one is 100% goatmilk and the other 100% water. Vicki


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## hsmomof4 (Oct 31, 2008)

Do we want to control for water quality by all using distilled or something like that?


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## LLB101 (Sep 29, 2009)

Vicki McGaugh Tx Nubians said:


> ...just do OMH?
> 
> I get Lacia!!!
> 
> ...Whose game? Vicki


You finally understand me? :biggrin

Not sure what it means to be "gotten" here :lol but I'm game for experiments!

I am horribly reactive to some chemical scents, eyes burn, throat tightens, one of the very few asthma triggers for me, so use a natural EO for lower risk, thanks!

And what's OMH?

Ok, let's see if I have this...

Soapers side of this experiment, are making 2 beige soaps w(ith OMH?) and some nice EO, otherwise identical except one will be all water and one all GM, right? If they look the same, the testers will have to be sure to keep them straight?

Testers side of this experiment, will test 2 bars each from the same maker, 2 different soapers, keep track of which is 1A and 1B and 2A and 2B, and report on any detected differences.

Anything I'm missing?

Should we test from at least 2 soapers each so an accidental variable will be reduced? And then each soaper would have 2 testers too, just for bonus objectivity. We don't want to go too overboard  but 2 each seems like a reasonable check and balance.

Should be fun! I'm really VERY curious, and mystified that GM has such a marketing pull if you really can't tell the difference.


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## NubianSoaps.com (Oct 26, 2007)

OMH is Oatmeal Milk and Honey, it's a fragrance. On it's own 100% goatmilk is going to react with the lye, the lye heats up and is going to burn some of the butterfat and sugar, this is going to make a beige bar. If we then give you a 100% white water bar, everyone is going to know right off which bar is which. So by using the OMH scent which is high in vanilla both bars will be equally tan. Once you start making soap you will find just like I have a most of my customrs, that you are not allergic to scent, you are allergic to the carriers put in scent that makes it perfumed. We don't soap or make toletries with these. OMH is very mild, is a pleasing almond scent.....and we sort of morphed this quickly into a soap swap on the other thread. Just PM me your address if you want to have soap sent to you.

Stacey, no I think water is fine  V


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## LLB101 (Sep 29, 2009)

I understood about the milk turning beige, I have a made a few batches of soap 

Not hooked yet, but I really want to be :lol
I have gallons of milk frozen flat for soaping, thought I'd be doing tons of it by now.

I hope you're right about the scents. We'll find out! I just know that some little old ladies perfume overkill, and dept store areas and well meaning friends with scented candles just about do me in... its embarrassing in the ER to day a little old lady's perfume got me :rofl

Since I've had the goats and back on raw milk and kefir etc, my allergies have gotten so much better, my health in general. I've only had a couple major incidents since 2008.

I'll PM you, I love experiments! :biggrin


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